US American Thread Part VI

[dcdeb]

Hi Mindy!

 

There are a number of US fans still here but I guess we don't hang out in this thread as much.

 

Welcome, though, and I'm happy to chat here when I can! I'm in Northern VA just outside of DC.

 

[MaureenG]

Howdy, 

 

I am Maureen from Houston, Texas. I have posted on MFC Introductions about myself.  I so excited I will be attending my first Mika in April 2022 in Brooklyn , New York. 

Edited January 20, 2022 by MaureenG

[dancinginsanremo]

Just popping in to introduce myself  Mika fan from WA state 🌲 

[ElizaWilson]

Hello! I've been an MFC member for a few years but I haven't been on here in a while, so I wanted to reintroduce myself.

I'm Lauren, I'm 15, and I discovered Mika when I was in kindergarten. I was a fan of Victorious/Ariana Grande at the time and discovered Mika through Popular Song. My favorite album is TBWKTM, and I own all of Mika's albums as CDs!

[CharlotteL]

Hello American friends 

Can I quickly ask you a language related question?!

My friend @jatspeedy and I have been bickering over some lyrics in stuck in the middle the whole evening and would love to hear the interpretations of some native speakers.

 

The part we're confused about is the bridge:
"This is just who I am 

This ain't a greater plan

To break your heart over / of me"

 

We can't agree on whether it's over or of. And the question is not which one you understand acoustically but which one makes sense grammatically and what you think "your version" means. Thank you!

[silver]

12 minutes ago, CharlotteL said:

Hello American friends 

Can I quickly ask you a language related question?!

My friend @jatspeedy and I have been bickering over some lyrics in stuck in the middle the whole evening and would love to hear the interpretations of some native speakers.

 

The part we're confused about is the bridge:
"This is just who I am 

This ain't a greater plan

To break your heart over / of me"

 

We can't agree on whether it's over or of. And the question is not which one you understand acoustically but which one makes sense grammatically and what you think "your version" means. Thank you!

 

I'm not American, but it's "over".  Breaking your heart over someone is a common expression.  Break your heart of me doesn't make sense in English (or American).

[dcdeb]

It's OVER.  Positively.

 

OF would make no sense in this context.

 

What I think the whole phrase means is simply that he's not doing or saying anything to break his grandmother's (or whoever's) heart on purpose, doesn't mean to upset anyone intentionally -- he is just being himself, being true to himself.

 

 

[Patricia Birden]

The beauty of Mika’s lyrics…. I love deciphering them…….and often I come up with different words myself🤣. I seem to always be conjuring up different stories in my head………..and that’s the fun aspect of his lyrics…… even though an awful lot of them are really really dark and some are painful. But it’s the music that makes it all very cheerful but behind that are stories that break your own  heart.

[jatspeedy]

13 hours ago, dcdeb said:

It's OVER.  Positively.

 

OF would make no sense in this context.

 

What I think the whole phrase means is simply that he's not doing or saying anything to break his grandmother's (or whoever's) heart on purpose, doesn't mean to upset anyone intentionally -- he is just being himself, being true to himself.

 

 

But couldn't you use "of me" too? I looked at the sentence like this: "This ain't a greater plan (to break your heart) of me." So the "to break your heart" describes the plan that he has (or hasn't) made more closely.

I know that you'd rather say "This ain't a greater plan of me to break your heart.", but couldn't you also use the first way without it being grammatically incorrect? Vice versa, wouldn't it have to be "This ain't a greater plan for you to break your heart over me." for it to be a correct sentence? I just feel like there's something missing without the "for you".

Then again, I'm just an English teacher, it's not my mother tongue, so I'm genuinely curious what you think about this!

[CharlotteL]

Well I'm very glad you outed yourself as the person with that position @jatspeedy and I can't believe you're still defending this linguistic insanity!

And that's the last you're gonna hear from me about this. 

Edited October 18, 2023 by CharlotteL

[silver]

4 hours ago, jatspeedy said:

But couldn't you use "of me" too? I looked at the sentence like this: "This ain't a greater plan (to break your heart) of me." So the "to break your heart" describes the plan that he has (or hasn't) made more closely.

I know that you'd rather say "This ain't a greater plan of me to break your heart.", but couldn't you also use the first way without it being grammatically incorrect? Vice versa, wouldn't it have to be "This ain't a greater plan for you to break your heart over me." for it to be a correct sentence? I just feel like there's something missing without the "for you".

Then again, I'm just an English teacher, it's not my mother tongue, so I'm genuinely curious what you think about this!

 

You wouldn't say "a plan of me".  You'd say "a plan of mine", or more likely, "my plan". 

 

 

[dcdeb]

5 hours ago, jatspeedy said:

But couldn't you use "of me" too? I looked at the sentence like this: "This ain't a greater plan (to break your heart) of me." So the "to break your heart" describes the plan that he has (or hasn't) made more closely.

I know that you'd rather say "This ain't a greater plan of me to break your heart.", but couldn't you also use the first way without it being grammatically incorrect? Vice versa, wouldn't it have to be "This ain't a greater plan for you to break your heart over me." for it to be a correct sentence? I just feel like there's something missing without the "for you".

Then again, I'm just an English teacher, it's not my mother tongue, so I'm genuinely curious what you think about this!

 

Sorry, you just wouldn't say "a greater plan to break your heart of me."

 

I know Mika has written some awkward sentence / lyric constructions over the years (and don't get me started on "lonely is so lonely alone"! ) but this isn't one of them.

 

If you don't believe me, watch this video, where you can clearly see and hear him say, "OVER me." At about 2:36.

 

 

[jatspeedy]

49 minutes ago, dcdeb said:

 

Sorry, you just wouldn't say "a greater plan to break your heart of me."

 

I know Mika has written some awkward sentence / lyric constructions over the years (and don't get me started on "lonely is so lonely alone"! ) but this isn't one of them.

 

If you don't believe me, watch this video, where you can clearly see and hear him say, "OVER me." At about 2:36.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, silver said:

 

You wouldn't say "a plan of me".  You'd say "a plan of mine", or more likely, "my plan". 

 

 

Thank you both!

 

I went with "over me" anyways for the exam that I created for my students (that's the reason why the discussion with Charlotte started in the first place), so I'm glad I decided to go with that since it does seem to be the correct version!

[CharlotteL]

3 hours ago, dcdeb said:

and don't get me started on "lonely is so lonely alone

You know what, I actually don't mind that one, lonely IS so lonely alone

 

Another one that I think is such an odd sentence but for some reason I'm obsessed with is "Isn't it enough just to be sunny and dumb". So many of his lyrics just should not work but somehow they do.

[dcdeb]

3 minutes ago, CharlotteL said:

You know what, I actually don't mind that one, lonely IS so lonely alone

 

Another one that I think is such an odd sentence but for some reason I'm obsessed with is "Isn't it enough just to be sunny and dumb". So many of his lyrics just should not work but somehow they do.

 

I don't mind "sunny and dumb" -- but "lonely is so lonely alone"? I don't get it. I have a (not too long) list of troublesome lyrics -- maybe we need a new thread

[silver]

2 minutes ago, dcdeb said:

 

I don't mind "sunny and dumb" -- but "lonely is so lonely alone"? I don't get it. I have a (not too long) list of troublesome lyrics -- maybe we need a new thread

 

Oh yes, there are some horrible lyrics we could discuss.  On the other hand, he can come up with some wonderful lines.

[holdingyourdrink]

9 minutes ago, dcdeb said:

 

I don't mind "sunny and dumb" -- but "lonely is so lonely alone"? I don't get it. I have a (not too long) list of troublesome lyrics -- maybe we need a new thread

Should the thread be called “pet peeves lyrics” 

[CharlotteL]

1 minute ago, dcdeb said:

maybe we need a new thread

I WOULD LOVE THAT! A Mikenglish thread (not as catchy as Mikamaths I admit).

 

Well the whole song is about how he was always moving around and never felt truly at home anywhere, right?!

So my interpretation is that the second verse is him saying he gave up putting down roots (and possibly making friends) completely because what's the point when you have to leave again anyway. So he "tried to live alone". But being on your own when you truly have no one to help you through it is very difficult and extra isolating. Like just being a bit "lonely" sometimes isn't too bad but when you can't even share those feelings with anybody else, it becomes unbearable. In other words "lonely is so lonely alone".

[dcdeb]

6 minutes ago, silver said:

 

Oh yes, there are some horrible lyrics we could discuss.  On the other hand, he can come up with some wonderful lines.

 

Yes, to be fair, that is absolutely true!

[Patricia Birden]

On 10/18/2023 at 6:51 PM, dcdeb said:

 

Sorry, you just wouldn't say "a greater plan to break your heart of me."

 

I know Mika has written some awkward sentence / lyric constructions over the years (and don't get me started on "lonely is so lonely alone"! ) but this isn't one of them.

 

If you don't believe me, watch this video, where you can clearly see and hear him say, "OVER me." At about 2:36.

 

 

And I love his way of thinking and I enjoyed seeing this again……

[QueenBigFat]

On 10/18/2023 at 5:01 PM, dcdeb said:

 

I don't mind "sunny and dumb" -- but "lonely is so lonely alone"? I don't get it. I have a (not too long) list of troublesome lyrics -- maybe we need a new thread

Just popping in to say that sunny and dumb describes a lot of my friends from high school. Dyed blond hair and mental development to match. Imagine batting lashes and chewing gum at the same time.

As for the lonely line, that actually resembles a twist on a similar phrase—about how being alone doesn’t mean that one is necessarily lonely (but it CAN mean that). But the way it’s written, while poetic, in a very poignant song, and fits well rhythmically, does not, to me, work in practice.