2015 - Adelphi Theatre, London 18 October - REPORTS/PICS/VIDS

[tiibet]

thank you Nina, for this post and for remembering me of some ethics. You are right: patronizing is not a nice or respectful thing to do

Sorry, sometimes writing on a forum doesn't bring out the best of me. I hope that I would dare to say everything to Mika in his face. But even if I might, saying things to someone is not the same as saying things about someone.  

I'll be more careful.   

 

Oh I definitely didn't write my post to remind anyone! Sorry if it sounded like that. It was more to describe how I try to choose my own words and just some thoughts that came to my mind this morning when I read the long discussion from yesterday/this morning. I feel more comfortable if I try to write things I could tell the person face to face even I know this forum is only for fans. It makes things easier and simple.

 

Nina, you are a lovely lady and I am sure you do lots of things well.  Don't be  so hard on yourself.  And I know you love animals, you will always be high on my list for that alone.

 

Thanks Bab! It's so funny you mention animals! It was the first thing I thought when I saw you on the forum again (haven't seen you here lately). Loving animals is definitely something we share  And I agree it's important. 

[Christine]

It's not just 5 seconds of his life. If we believe him, the impact on him was at least during a big part of the concert.

I DON'T believe him and neither should you. He said he stopped talking to the audience and this is clearly not true. How much more proof do people need that his story is almost entirely fabricated? You have seen the video. I was there and didn't even notice anything. Mika yapped all night long. If this incident had been anything at all like what Mika is portraying it would have already been addressed right after the gig by his fans. Other fans would have commented in this thread how a fan was rude and interrupting the show, how Mika seemed upset and withdrawn. Do you think a woman shouting insults at Mika from the front row would have gone unnoticed by everyone but Mika? This was a non incident until he chose to make fun of Jemma at the French gig and now this.

 

He may have been overreacting at the concert to the shouting and it sure wasn't right to talk about Jemma like that. But that doesn't mean he is responsable for all the hatred she is getting now. I blame the people that harass her for that, not Mika. And maybe all of us because we keep talking about it.

He is totally responsible for it because he made her sound like a xenophobe. Of course his fans are going to react to that, just like they reacted to the faggot graffiti, as he well knows. Not only are people going to perceive this as a hate motivated attack on Mika but if they are French they are going to perceive it as an attack on themselves.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Christine

[Pascale]

Oh I definitely didn't write my post to remind anyone! Sorry if it sounded like that. It was more to describe how I try to choose my own words and just some thoughts that came to my mind this morning when I read the long discussion from yesterday/this morning. I feel more comfortable if I try to write things I could tell the person face to face even I know this forum is only for fans. It makes things easier and simple.

 

Well, whom the cap fits, let him wear it (i hope this is proper English, i used the dictionary but i've never heard the expression in English)

And I wore it  .

Edited March 10, 2016 by Pascale

[dcdeb]

I understand the difference. I just dont how critical can a post be, when will the post be too critical it reach the level of mean/rude? Or is a mean/rude post towards mika also acceptable?

 

 

Yang, how much have you really looked at this forum? Especially the threads from the past years? It is filled to the brim with both criticism of and praise for Mika. That's how it works. Is there some "mean" or "rude" talk about him? Obviously there is. But to be completely honest with you, I find criticizing him for his behavior in this specific case -- for something that he has actually done -- is far less rude and disrepectful than all the posts that treat him as a piece of meat, analyzing and/or drooling over every square inch of his body, from his hair (or lack of it) down to his "butt' and his "ugly toes." I find it less disrespectful than those people who create fan fiction (especially slash) about him. I find it less disrespectful and rude than the posts that superimpose his head on someone else's body, or those posts that make fun of screen caps that catch him in an awkward facial expression.

 

 

Mika is not here, mika fans are here, and A LOT mika fans (like me)  understand fandom in a completely different way. I can see what other people said about the idol I loved and cherished, and you dont think that will trigger a fight in someway?

 

This being said, if mika does not mind being criticized in that way, and does not think it's mean/rude. Then maybe I should let it go too.

 

 

I think maybe you should. Why should someone expressing their opinion about Mika "trigger a fight"? There's no need to fight if you disagree with someone. You are the only person who chooses how you react to something. (And I don't mean YOU specifically, I'm speaking in the general sense of "you all".)  For example, if someone says they hate Mika's song "Make You Happy" because it is so repetitive, I could choose to be offended because I love that song and I could call them an idiot and argue with them about why they're wrong and I'm right. Or I could choose to accept that everyone likes different things and move on. I might want to point out some of the reasons I like the song, but I won't "fight" with them over it. There's no reason to.

 

 

So I just try to estimate what I could say face to face to him or to anyone I'm talking about and about this episode I wouldn't say he is a liar or being unprofessional or victimizing himself or acting like a baby. I don't think any of that. I would say he seemed hurt. Hurt either by that separate situation and the comment coming in the middle of his performance or by the whole issue and the whole thought of that not accepting his French side means not accepting him as a person. I would also say that maybe because he felt hurt he wasn't careful enough when he spoke in the interview or he simply didn't think it all through. I mean something went wrong. Just look around, there's a war zone.

 

I actually try to use that rule of "Would I say that to his/her face?" in all of my dealings on the internet, not just with Mika. I mean, I think a lot of people hide behind their computer screens and would never say some of the things they say online in real life to a real person. I'm not like that. I try to be here in this forum as I am in real life, because I know that words can hurt and have power, and sometimes -- no, oftentimes -- what you MEAN is not conveyed as clearly online as it would be in real life.

 

Having said all that, I DO believe Mika must have been hurt by this incident. At the very least, it made enough of an impression on him that he felt compelled to mention it several times. And I agree that this is all an emotional or gut response, rather than something that he thought through. But he really should have just let it go. If he felt hurt by a fan, trying to hurt him/her in return was not a good response. As my mother used to say, "Two wrongs don't make a right."

 

 

[Christine]

Having said all that, I DO believe Mika must have been hurt by this incident. At the very least, it made enough of an impression on him that he felt compelled to mention it several times. And I agree that this is all an emotional or gut response, rather than something that he thought through. But he really should have just let it go. If he felt hurt by a fan, trying to hurt him/her in return was not a good response. As my mother used to say, "Two wrongs don't make a right."

Yes I do believe he was hurt so I don't think he fabricated the incident in that sense. But that is a separate issue from being publicly humiliated (which didn't happen), it a separate issue from someone shouting insults at you while you're on stage (which didn't happen), it is a separate issue from being so unnerved that it prohibits the normal interaction with the audience and ruins the show (which didn't happen).

 

It really makes me wonder how he feels about so many incidents that he could feel so hurt about this. He has had millions of interactions with fans and I am sure many of them are far worse by any objective measure.

Edited March 10, 2016 by Christine

[krysady]

I DON'T believe him and neither should you. He said he stopped talking to the audience and this is clearly not true. How much more proof do people need that his story is almost entirely fabricated? 

 

 

He said " I talked a lot less to the audience" if I'm hearing right,not that he stopped talking at all.

[babspanky]

 

 

 

 I actually try to use that rule of "Would I say that to his/her face?" in all of my dealings on the internet, not just with Mika. I mean, I think a lot of people hide behind their computer screens and would never say some of the things they say online in real life to a real person. I'm not like that. I try to be here in this forum as I am in real life, because I know that words can hurt and have power, and sometimes -- no, oftentimes -- what you MEAN is not conveyed as clearly online as it would be in real life.

 

Having said all that, I DO believe Mika must have been hurt by this incident. At the very least, it made enough of an impression on him that he felt compelled to mention it several times. And I agree that this is all an emotional or gut response, rather than something that he thought through. But he really should have just let it go. If he felt hurt by a fan, trying to hurt him/her in return was not a good response. As my mother used to say, "Two wrongs don't make a right."

Sadly I would say these things to peoples' faces. Maybe that's why I am Billy No Mates. 

 

I also do believe Mika was hurt by the incident in some small way but more along the lines of the truth hurts. I'm sure he'd like everyone to love everything he does and this was just a small reminder that they don't and aren't shy about saying so.  He really should have expected it , the audiences in the UK have always heckled and told him what they really thought.

 

I was watching a tv show last night with celebrities ( actors, comedians and singers)  and they were all asked what their worst experience of heckling was. One comedian said that someone had mooned at her from the front row. . So you see it's just not unusual. I have no idea what it's like in other countries.

Edited March 10, 2016 by babspanky

[RAK1]

 

 

Yang, how much have you really looked at this forum? Especially the threads from the past years? It is filled to the brim with both criticism of and praise for Mika. That's how it works. Is there some "mean" or "rude" talk about him? Obviously there is. But to be completely honest with you, I find criticizing him for his behavior in this specific case -- for something that he has actually done -- is far less rude and disrepectful than all the posts that treat him as a piece of meat, analyzing and/or drooling over every square inch of his body, from his hair (or lack of it) down to his "butt' and his "ugly toes." I find it less disrespectful than those people who create fan fiction (especially slash) about him. I find it less disrespectful and rude than the posts that superimpose his head on someone else's body, or those posts that make fun of screen caps that catch him in an awkward facial expression.

 

 

 

 

I think maybe you should. Why should someone expressing their opinion about Mika "trigger a fight"? There's no need to fight if you disagree with someone. You are the only person who chooses how you react to something. (And I don't mean YOU specifically, I'm speaking in the general sense of "you all".) For example, if someone says they hate Mika's song "Make You Happy" because it is so repetitive, I could choose to be offended because I love that song and I could call them an idiot and argue with them about why they're wrong and I'm right. Or I could choose to accept that everyone likes different things and move on. I might want to point out some of the reasons I like the song, but I won't "fight" with them over it. There's no reason to.

 

 

 

 

I actually try to use that rule of "Would I say that to his/her face?" in all of my dealings on the internet, not just with Mika. I mean, I think a lot of people hide behind their computer screens and would never say some of the things they say online in real life to a real person. I'm not like that. I try to be here in this forum as I am in real life, because I know that words can hurt and have power, and sometimes -- no, oftentimes -- what you MEAN is not conveyed as clearly online as it would be in real life.

 

Having said all that, I DO believe Mika must have been hurt by this incident. At the very least, it made enough of an impression on him that he felt compelled to mention it several times. And I agree that this is all an emotional or gut response, rather than something that he thought through. But he really should have just let it go. If he felt hurt by a fan, trying to hurt him/her in return was not a good response. As my mother used to say, "Two wrongs don't make a right."

Like I said earlier, he knows Jemma follows him on Twitter, a DM to her could have cleared it all up later that evening, and none of us would be having this discussion now.

[tiibet]

 

 I actually try to use that rule of "Would I say that to his/her face?" in all of my dealings on the internet, not just with Mika. I mean, I think a lot of people hide behind their computer screens and would never say some of the things they say online in real life to a real person. I'm not like that. I try to be here in this forum as I am in real life, because I know that words can hurt and have power, and sometimes -- no, oftentimes -- what you MEAN is not conveyed as clearly online as it would be in real life.

 

Exactly. And it's different when you have met people in real life compared to communicating only via internet. I travel a lot so I have met many people on mfc at gigs and I will meet them again, people have faces. That's why asked to leave my name out when talking about some issues on twitter. I didn't do it to insult anyone or to take sides. I just wanted to be outside of some conversations that make me feel uncomfortable. 

[Christine]

He said " I talked a lot less to the audience" if I'm hearing right,not that he stopped talking at all.

 

It's still not true. I have seen enough gigs to know when he is chatty and when he isn't and he was yapping away all night. I don't think Mika is lying, I think he has just spent 6 months blowing this out of all proportion in his mind. Or perhaps his perspective is clouded by a feeling that Brits in general are intolerant of other cultures or some past comments he has read from other fans on this topic.

[krysady]

 

It's still not true. I have seen enough gigs to know when he is chatty and when he isn't and he was yapping away all night. I don't think Mika is lying, I think he has just spent 6 months blowing this out of all proportion in his mind. Or perhaps his perspective is clouded by a feeling that Brits in general are intolerant of other cultures or some past comments he has read from other fans on this topic.

 

You know better,you were there 

 

Or maybe that was just came up in his mind at that moment,he looked like he was genuinely trying to find an answer for every question he got right at that moment. I don't know if he got the questions in advance. Honestly,I don't think his feelings toward Brits are so negative,on the contrary,he's talking very nice about that subject here : http://yp.scmp.com/entertainment/music/article/102901/mika-reveals-his-love-dim-sum-why-small-gigs-are-important-and

[Christine]

Or maybe that was just came up in his mind at that moment,he looked like he was genuinely trying to find an answer for every question he got right at that moment. I don't know if he got the questions in advance. Honestly,I don't think his feelings toward Brits are so negative,on the contrary,he's talking very nice about that subject here : http://yp.scmp.com/entertainment/music/article/102901/mika-reveals-his-love-dim-sum-why-small-gigs-are-important-and

I think that rather illustrates his negative opinion about British culture and how it affects his work, even if he sees it as changing now. And again, he is directly contrasting the good qualities of the French (they are culturally curious) with the negative qualities of the Brits (irreverent, mean, destructive opinions). I am not saying Mika hates the Brits or something, just that he is very sensitive to being rejected by the music industry (and perhaps his former fans) in the UK. I think he could handle the "mean" opinions in the early days because his album was #1 for weeks so it was a real f-you to his critics. Now it feels like a low blow. And I guess it upsets him that some of the British fans he has left are actually typical Brits (who do not listen to French pop music and don't want to) and are not living in his French/Italian/Lebanese/American bubble.

[krysady]

 I am not saying Mika hates the Brits or something, just that he is very sensitive to being rejected by the music industry 

 

You are right on this,this is my opinion too 

[Christine]

I was watching a tv show last night with celebrities ( actors, comedians and singers)  and they were all asked what their worst experience of heckling was. One comedian said that someone had mooned at her from the front row. . So you see it's just not unusual. I have no idea what it's like in other countries.

It's the same in North America. There are a couple of stand up comedians in the US who have huge podcasts and many of their guests are other comedians. They have tons of war stories about audience confrontations and seem especially annoyed by women who are out on their hen night For some comedians their whole style is improving (rather than telling jokes) so success of their performance is entirely dependent on how they read and handle the audience.

[Lunari]

I think that rather illustrates his negative opinion about British culture and how it affects his work, even if he sees it as changing now. And again, he is directly contrasting the good qualities of the French (they are culturally curious) with the negative qualities of the Brits (irreverent, mean, destructive opinions). I am not saying Mika hates the Brits or something, just that he is very sensitive to being rejected by the music industry (and perhaps his former fans) in the UK. I think he could handle the "mean" opinions in the early days because his album was #1 for weeks so it was a real f-you to his critics. Now it feels like a low blow. And I guess it upsets him that some of the British fans he has left are actually typical Brits (who do not listen to French pop music and don't want to) and are not living in his French/Italian/Lebanese/American bubble.

 

I think this may be the crux of the matter and sort of a vicious circle: Mika feels (at least on some level) rejected by the UK and much more warmly embraced by France (plus some other countries). This has led to him embracing the French part of his identity even more. Unfortunately, the UK fans in turn feel rejected by him and want "the British Mika" back, while he seems to think along the lines of "if you want me, you have to accept all of me, even the French part, because this is who I am". So he sings a French song in London and when someone expresses disapproval, he doesn't see this just a criticism of his setlist, but as a rejection of him personally. At least that's my opinion on why he reacted so strongly to something seemingly insignificant.

[RAK1]

It's the same in North America. There are a couple of stand up comedians in the US who have huge podcasts and many of their guests are other comedians. They have tons of war stories about audience confrontations and seem especially annoyed by women who are out on their hen night For some comedians their whole style is improving (rather than telling jokes) so success of their performance is entirely dependent on how they read and handle the audience.

We have a comedian here called Jimmy Carr, who has turned burning hecklers into an artform. He is REALLY good at it.

[RAK1]

I think this may be the crux of the matter and sort of a vicious circle: Mika feels (at least on some level) rejected by the UK and much more warmly embraced by France (plus some other countries). This has led to him embracing the French part of his identity even more. Unfortunately, the UK fans in turn feel rejected by him and want "the British Mika" back, while he seems to think along the lines of "if you want me, you have to accept all of me, even the French part, because this is who I am". So he sings a French song in London and when someone expresses disapproval, he doesn't see this just a criticism of his setlist, but as a rejection of him personally. At least that's my opinion on why he reacted so strongly to something seemingly insignificant.

I think you have summed it up pretty well there.

[Christine]

I think this may be the crux of the matter and sort of a vicious circle: Mika feels (at least on some level) rejected by the UK and much more warmly embraced by France (plus some other countries). This has led to him embracing the French part of his identity even more. Unfortunately, the UK fans in turn feel rejected by him and want "the British Mika" back, while he seems to think along the lines of "if you want me, you have to accept all of me, even the French part, because this is who I am". So he sings a French song in London and when someone expresses disapproval, he doesn't see this just a criticism of his setlist, but as a rejection of him personally. At least that's my opinion on why he reacted so strongly to something seemingly insignificant.

 

Agree 100%.

 

I wish Mika (and French fans) could be a bit more understanding about where this is coming from and not dismiss it as xenophobia. I know most countries are accustomed to listening to English music but I don't believe for a minute that it would not start to upset some French and Italian fans if Mika shifted his career to Asia and started singing in Korean and waiting 3 years between shows in Paris or Milan. I see them moaning on Mika's Facebook if the posts are not translated to French so I am a bit tired of this holier-than-thou attitude. All you have to do is listen to some Spanish fans who also feel left out of the French/Italian situation to know that this isn't entirely about the insularity of English language culture.

 

We have a comedian here called Jimmy Carr, who has turned burning hecklers into an artform. He is REALLY good at it.

Hehe, good for him.

[Pascale]

I think this may be the crux of the matter and sort of a vicious circle: Mika feels (at least on some level) rejected by the UK and much more warmly embraced by France (plus some other countries). This has led to him embracing the French part of his identity even more. Unfortunately, the UK fans in turn feel rejected by him and want "the British Mika" back, while he seems to think along the lines of "if you want me, you have to accept all of me, even the French part, because this is who I am". So he sings a French song in London and when someone expresses disapproval, he doesn't see this just a criticism of his setlist, but as a rejection of him personally. At least that's my opinion on why he reacted so strongly to something seemingly insignificant.

I agree 100% as well. Wow, that's new. We all agree about something.   

[yang]

I thought I would just give up. But I realized that I had more to say.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is a difference between wanting MIKA to sing more English songs and wanting MIKA not to sing just ONE French song. The former is because some fans prefer English songs better, which is totally understandable. The latter is pure exclusive(not sure if this is the right word) and do not worth sympathy, because begging MIKA to not sing just ONE French song is also depriving the chance of other fans to hear it live.

As I mentioned, there are even fans in UK area love this song live, you can see their posts here expressing their love in BBB, don't ignore that.

Edited March 10, 2016 by yang

[yang]

I do not think MIKA handle this issue very well, I mentioned this opinion in the beginning. But what happens now is not 100% his fault, I am very sure of that.

[yang]

I think this may be the crux of the matter and sort of a vicious circle: Mika feels (at least on some level) rejected by the UK and much more warmly embraced by France (plus some other countries). This has led to him embracing the French part of his identity even more. Unfortunately, the UK fans in turn feel rejected by him and want "the British Mika" back, while he seems to think along the lines of "if you want me, you have to accept all of me, even the French part, because this is who I am". So he sings a French song in London and when someone expresses disapproval, he doesn't see this just a criticism of his setlist, but as a rejection of him personally. At least that's my opinion on why he reacted so strongly to something seemingly insignificant.

 

This is a very reasonable explanation, 100% agreed.

 

Now I think the focus should be how to break this circle, and I do not think pushing Mika to change back to "British Mika" again, or pressuring him to say he handle the situation wrongly, is a good way to solve this problem.

 

The reality is, if Christine is right at the part MIKA is earning a lot money from gigs, he can always earn that money elsewhere he feel more ease and comfortable. One small gig comparing to all the other gigs he hold elsewhere is really insignificance, he does not have to hold a gig where he does not feel very comfortable.

 

Maybe some fans feel that if a gig in which they can not heckle MIKA is not worth going, or they do not care if MIKA holds concerts in London or not, then the problem is solved too.

Edited March 10, 2016 by yang

[jemmalee]

I do not think MIKA handle this issue very well, I mentioned this opinion in the beginning. But what happens now is not 100% his fault, I am very sure of that.

So it's not his fault that people have been calling me a xenophobic racist? The whole thing has been blown out of all proportion. Mika can sing what he wants, it's his show. How I've been treated for shouting out something said in jest is totally out of order. I have received abuse on social media from people who have never interacted with me or heard about me before Tuesday. I'm sure loads of you have come into this thread to read the drama and then pm each other the latest gossip. I'm totally sick of it.

I am not a xenophobe. I love France and my French friends. I'm not racist and if you knew me personally you would definitely know this. I am not a mean person. I'm not intolerant. I accidentally hurt the feelings of a pop star as I was hurt leading up to the moment.

This doesn't give Mika the right to slag me off at a concert in France saying that I need more sex in my life and then 6 months later say on television that I'm mean & intolerant. This also doesn't give the right for anyone to abuse me. The last couple of days have been complete hell for me and I'm sure it's not going to stop anytime soon. That is Mika's fault.

[RAK1]

I thought I would just give up. But I realized that I had more to say.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is a difference between wanting MIKA to sing more English songs and wanting MIKA not to sing just ONE French song. The former is because some fans prefer English songs better, which is totally understandable. The latter is pure exclusive(not sure if this is the right word) and do not worth sympathy, because begging MIKA to not sing just ONE French song is also depriving the chance of other fans to hear it live.

As I mentioned, there are even fans in UK area love this song live, you can see their posts here expressing their love in BBB, don't ignore that.

Once again, can I direct you to the fact that not all UK fans are members of the fan club, so many of them don't have a clue where this or any of the French songs come from, as they aren't watching every single move Mika makes, only when he brings out new music here. And this doesn't make them bad fans, it makes them fans who like the music he releases here. I'm sure if he released a French song here, they may like it or they may not. No one knows unless he tries it.

[yang]

Once again, can I direct you to the fact that not all UK fans are members of the fan club, so many of them don't have a clue where this or any of the French songs come from, as they aren't watching every single move Mika makes, only when he brings out new music here. And this doesn't make them bad fans, it makes them fans who like the music he releases here. I'm sure if he released a French song here, they may like it or they may not. No one knows unless he tries it.

 

Yeah but BBB's video is on youtube and is available to everyone. Despite this fact, I'm not saying that if they don't like French songs, they are bad fans. But if they are begging him NOT to sing ONE French song because they don't like it or don't know it, ignoring the fact that there're audiences in the room who happen to like it, that is just wrong.