MIKA eyes eurovision entry

[DerMoment1608]

I have brought this from the Twitter thread..........

 

Thank you

 

Personally I would agree that the UK hasn't put in any decent entries lately - but I still don't honestly think it has much to do with the result.

 

As the UK didn't have a great entry we don't really have prove if it's they case or not. But for me there are some indications that it isn't the case, as I wrote before:

 

With better entries you got more points, it's not that you don't get any points regardless what you do.

 

And then the case of Germany. Of course it doesn't necessarily mean that it would be the same with Britain, but the situation for both countries in the contest is/was very similar: Both big singular countries, both getting nearly no points for years and a lot of people saying "nobody likes us, we won't get any points regardless what we do". And then Germany won 2010 with 246 points and points given from 34 out of 39 countries (just for comparison the places before: 24 (2005), 14 (2006), 19 (2007) 23 (2008), 20 (2009))

 

So, if Germany could do it, why not the UK as well?

 

And I really hope the UK would pull out a great entry and win with it. Just to prove that its possible

 

But by the way the BBC is handling this at the moment I have no big hope

 

As for Terry Wogan, if I recall it right he pulled out after the win of Russia in 2008 saying something along the lines that all the Eastern countries are voting for each other and no Western countries have a chance at all (please correct me, if I'm wrong).

 

Okay, I googled a little bit and found same quotes from him:

 

"I think the British music industry and the BBC really have to look at this and see how they can avoid this yearly debacle. At the very beginning of the year I said Russia would win for political reasons and they did.""

 

Yes, Russia did win this year. But if it is "only" political, why Russia didn't win all the years before and after? There are so much different reason that come together.

 

One of them is "block voting" and "diaspora voting", yes. You can't deny that it happens. But question one is how much difference it makes really for the result and how much is really political and not just "shared cultural identity". Like UK giving the Jedward a lot of points. Is it because they were famous at the time and a lot in the media, because people knew them and there song - or because the UK loves Ireland so much?

 

Also Dima Bilan was a very famous singer in a lot of Eastern countries at the time. So it's not that surprising that he got a lot of points from these countries.

 

When Ukraine awarded Russia the maximum 12 points, Wogan commented: "Ukraine want to be absolutely sure that the electricity and the oil flows through." As Latvia did the same he said it knew which side its bread was buttered on.

 

As he picked out these two countries I'm doing that as well.

 

Points Latvia gave to Russia:

 

10 (2005), 12 (2006), 7 (2007), 12 (2008), 6 (2009), 8 (2010), 0 (2011), 12 (2012)

 

Russia only got 12 points from Latvia in the 2 years Dima Bilan was a contestant (2006 + 2008) and in 2012 (where Russia generally got a lot of points). It's not the case that countries are giving blindly points to other countries.

 

With the Ukraine there is a stronger country-country-correlation:

 

4 (2005), 12 (2006), 8 (2007), 12 (2008), 8 (2009), 10 (2010), 10 (2010)

 

But even here there is also a correlation between the entry itself and the points, not only between countries.

 

Of course these two countries are an example that Russia gets nearly constantly points from them, too. So yes, it's partly true that some countries get some points more and it probably does make a difference of some places, but it won't change the winner because he needs points from nearly all countries, you can't win with 50 points of block voting. There are around 40 countries every year that are voting after all. Of course aside from one case: if two entries are at eye level and one is in a voting block and one not.

 

So, yes, the UK has a slightly disadvantage because it is in no "block" (aside from Ireland). But that is true for all the other "big 5"-countries as well. And nevertheless Germany won in 2010. Or Italy became 2nd in 2011.

 

Over the closing titles he said it could be "goodnight western Europe".

 

And then look at the winners after Russia: Norway 2009, Germany 2010, Azerbaijan 2011, Sweden 2012. All of them typical Eastern countries…

 

So overall the biggest correlation by far for winning/very high position is "mass appealingness of an entry" (I don't want to call it "being good" as this can be very subjective ) to my mind

 

And really, if it would be so easy to predict the contest and everything is rigged, why does not everybody goes to betting sites, put on his money there and gets rich?

 

Source of quotes: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2008/may/26/news.russia

Source of points: http://eschome.net/index.html

 

And just to anticipate any new rumours (and just so that this endless post isn't totally off topic ): The contestant of France is already chosen, so it won't be Mika

[silver]

Thank you

 

 

 

As the UK didn't have a great entry we don't really have prove if it's they case or not. But for me there are some indications that it isn't the case, as I wrote before:

 

With better entries you got more points, it's not that you don't get any points regardless what you do.

 

And then the case of Germany. Of course it doesn't necessarily mean that it would be the same with Britain, but the situation for both countries in the contest is/was very similar: Both big singular countries, both getting nearly no points for years and a lot of people saying "nobody likes us, we won't get any points regardless what we do". And then Germany won 2010 with 246 points and points given from 34 out of 39 countries (just for comparison the places before: 24 (2005), 14 (2006), 19 (2007) 23 (2008), 20 (2009))

 

So, if Germany could do it, why not the UK as well?

 

And I really hope the UK would pull out a great entry and win with it. Just to prove that its possible

 

But by the way the BBC is handling this at the moment I have no big hope

 

As for Terry Wogan, if I recall it right he pulled out after the win of Russia in 2008 saying something along the lines that all the Eastern countries are voting for each other and no Western countries have a chance at all (please correct me, if I'm wrong).

 

Okay, I googled a little bit and found same quotes from him:

 

 

 

Yes, Russia did win this year. But if it is "only" political, why Russia didn't win all the years before and after? There are so much different reason that come together.

 

One of them is "block voting" and "diaspora voting", yes. You can't deny that it happens. But question one is how much difference it makes really for the result and how much is really political and not just "shared cultural identity". Like UK giving the Jedward a lot of points. Is it because they were famous at the time and a lot in the media, because people knew them and there song - or because the UK loves Ireland so much?

 

Also Dima Bilan was a very famous singer in a lot of Eastern countries at the time. So it's not that surprising that he got a lot of points from these countries.

 

 

 

As he picked out these two countries I'm doing that as well.

 

Points Latvia gave to Russia:

 

10 (2005), 12 (2006), 7 (2007), 12 (2008), 6 (2009), 8 (2010), 0 (2011), 12 (2012)

 

Russia only got 12 points from Latvia in the 2 years Dima Bilan was a contestant (2006 + 2008) and in 2012 (where Russia generally got a lot of points). It's not the case that countries are giving blindly points to other countries.

 

With the Ukraine there is a stronger country-country-correlation:

 

4 (2005), 12 (2006), 8 (2007), 12 (2008), 8 (2009), 10 (2010), 10 (2010)

 

But even here there is also a correlation between the entry itself and the points, not only between countries.

 

Of course these two countries are an example that Russia gets nearly constantly points from them, too. So yes, it's partly true that some countries get some points more and it probably does make a difference of some places, but it won't change the winner because he needs points from nearly all countries, you can't win with 50 points of block voting. There are around 40 countries every year that are voting after all. Of course aside from one case: if two entries are at eye level and one is in a voting block and one not.

 

So, yes, the UK has a slightly disadvantage because it is in no "block" (aside from Ireland). But that is true for all the other "big 5"-countries as well. And nevertheless Germany won in 2010. Or Italy became 2nd in 2011.

 

 

 

And then look at the winners after Russia: Norway 2009, Germany 2010, Azerbaijan 2011, Sweden 2012. All of them typical Eastern countries…

 

So overall the biggest correlation by far for winning/very high position is "mass appealingness of an entry" (I don't want to call it "being good" as this can be very subjective ) to my mind

 

And really, if it would be so easy to predict the contest and everything is rigged, why does not everybody goes to betting sites, put on his money there and gets rich?

 

Source of quotes: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2008/may/26/news.russia

Source of points: http://eschome.net/index.html

 

And just to anticipate any new rumours (and just so that this endless post isn't totally off topic ): The contestant of France is already chosen, so it won't be Mika

 

Wow! You've given this a lot of thought (and analysis).

 

It's true a good song should win regardless of the country it comes from, but political voting does happen, and that distorts the results.

 

I'm not denying that Mika could write a song capable of winning, but I don't think he would take the risk.

[Naectegale]

How can he be interviewed by GN in the UK being in Portland, USA, that day???

 

By telephone - it's a modern invention - catching on quite well with the younglings, i believe

 

it's the GN radio show on the Saturday, i think - so he could phone in

[willywonka]

By telephone - it's a modern invention - catching on quite well with the younglings, i believe

 

it's the GN radio show on the Saturday, i think - so he could phone in

 

 

I just thought it would be weird to do a phone interview in this case...

[Naectegale]

 

I just thought it would be weird to do a phone interview in this case...

 

i hope you are right about that

[RAK1]

Even though I don't like Eurovision as much as I did when I was a child (as I think it's so cheesy), I still hope that this is true. I understand why some may think it will ruin his career- but just look at Jade Ewen who represented us before. She became a member of the Sugababes sortly after, and she was a nobody before. I feel that this will be perfect promotion, and with Mika the UK has a good chance of winning- because of the success with Elle Me Dit and around Europe. It would be amazing promotion for his album and singles too.

 

And look what happened to them!

No hits to speak of since then.

Don't get me started on Jade Ewen!

I was a fan of the original Sugababes, so don't really like what happened after Emelle joined, they went down hill after that.

So she's not really a prime example of success after Eurovision.

[Christine]

 

I just thought it would be weird to do a phone interview in this case...

 

I listen to a popular CBC show and they have studios everywhere - London, NY, etc. So often guests are present in a studio but just not the same studio where the interviewer is located. From the listener's perspective there is no difference. It's not like a telephone call at all.

 

Mika will probably still be Vancouver during Graham's show, not Portland. They could easily set up this kind of interview.

 

Not that this gives the rumour any credibility, just pointing out that there is no reason for someone to be in the same studio as Graham Norton to be interviewed. It doesn't make any difference.

 

Speaking of which I need to start (well continue) harassing the CBC presenter to have Mika on his show when he's in Toronto.

[cathouzouf]

I listen to a popular CBC show and they have studios everywhere - London, NY, etc. So often guests are present in a studio but just not the same studio where the interviewer is located. From the listener's perspective there is no difference. It's not like a telephone call at all.

 

Mika will probably still be Vancouver during Graham's show, not Portland. They could easily set up this kind of interview.

 

Not that this gives the rumour any credibility, just pointing out that there is no reason for someone to be in the same studio as Graham Norton to be interviewed. It doesn't make any difference.

 

Speaking of which I need to start (well continue) harassing the CBC presenter to have Mika on his show when he's in Toronto.

 

Let me know if you need help

[kath]

:

 

 

 

As Silver said .....'Wow'!!!!!! You have certainly done your homework!!

 

I can not begin to counter your arguments. I think that my opinion is probably purely based on the general feeling that prevails in the UK - whether it has sound statisical backing or not. And that feeling (generally) is that the UK are not going to do well these days, no matter what. I think that the majority of hard core Mika fans on here (with the exception of Marilyn and maybe one or two more) fear that if that is the case, given the current status of Mika's image over here it could only be a bad thing if he were to represent the UK.

 

You may well be right regarding your analysis of recent winners - particularly Germany but I really, really can't see it happening here.

 

If Mika represented the UK and went on to win and have a massive resurgence of popularity here of course I would be delighted....and happily eat my words. But unfortunately I can't see it happening. .

Edited February 18, 2013 by kath

[Marilyn Mastin]

As Silver said .....'Wow'!!!!!! You have certainly done your homework!!

 

I can not begin to counter your arguments. I think that my opinion is probably purely based on the general feeling that prevails in the UK - whether it has sound statisical backing or not. And that feeling (generally) is that the UK are not going to do well these days, no matter what. I think that the majority of hard core Mika fans on here (with the exception of Marilyn and maybe one or two more) fear that if that is the case, given the current status of Mika's image over here it could only be a bad thing if he were to represent the UK.

 

You may well be right regarding your analysis of recent winners - particularly Germany but I really, really can't see it happening here.

 

If Mika represented the UK and went on to win and have a massive resurgence of popularity here of course I would be delighted....and happily eat my words. But unfortunately I can't see it happening. .

I just think it's worth him trying. He would get mentioned in the UK again, and even if people make fun of him, that's still publicity, and Mika himself has said he doesn't mind what people say, if they are talking about him.

From the time he released BG in the UK, people stopped taking him seriously. Now he's being ignored as a has-been. What's he got to loose?

We on here know how great he is, and how gorgeous. He's no longer the goofy-looking guy who sang GK, he's a total hottie! The UK need to see him now and fall for him!

Celebs do all kinds of things in the UK to save their careers. They eat kangaroo-whatsits in the jungle, they fall on their butts on the ice, they go in Celeb Big Brother, or become a judge on X Factor or The Voice, or BGT.

What's wrong with Mika in Eurovision? Of course, its his choice, but if he chooses to do it I can't see it doing anything but good. I don't think for a minute he'd come last. Europe love him too much for that and we'd have a great song! It would be great, but it's up to him in the end, if he does it of not.

Edited February 18, 2013 by Marilyn Mastin

[Soaring Simpson]

I'm with the people who think that if Mika does Eurovision (performing, he might get some mileage out of writing) it'll damn near prove to the UK, including me, that he's no longer interested in being a serious artist. I really, really hope he has more sense than to do it.

 

And I think he does have sense.

[Christine]

What is Mika going to prove to the UK by abstaining from Eurovision? As far as most people are concerned he disappeared 5 years ago. All you had to do was read the comments on the coming out articles. Some people didn't even know who he was. Today's teenagers were children the last time Mika was on the radio.

 

If I was in a position to advise him I would not advise him to do it. But I guess that's my own cultural bias because I don't relate to mainland European popular culture. I also think this is all a rumour and a moot point. But if the rumour was true then it would be a done deal and you just have to look at the good points.

 

It sounds to me like the lack of credibility with this competition is the crap quality of the songs and participants and it also sounds like it has gone through cycles throughout its lifetime. So some years are better than others and maybe having someone like Mika who is respected in countries like France will lift Eurovision up rather than drag Mika down.

 

Is it going to give him credibility in the UK? Perhaps not. But what is? No one is paying any attention to him. Is everyone saying they prefer him to disappear in obscurity than to embarrass them by being a noticeable participant in Eurovision? I don't get it.

[MikaMadLuke]

Christine, I feel the same about it.

 

What exactly has he got to lose as this point?

[Sabine64]

I really don´t know what to think about all this. I didn´t watch the Eurovision since years ( since a guys like Stefan Raab and Gildo Horn represented Germany only to make fun of the competition ).

The only thing I can say is if Mika would be there it would be the first and the only time that I would vote in that competition, I would vote for him like mad and I´m sure all German fans would try to give him points.

[krjsantos]

Yet we read things like that about him Twitter: @NME: The Brit Awards' 10 worst decisions ever http://www.nme.com/blog/index.php?blog=1&p=11880&title=the_brit_awards_10_worst_decisions_ever&more=1&c=1&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=britawardsblog

[Marilyn Mastin]

I'm with the people who think that if Mika does Eurovision (performing, he might get some mileage out of writing) it'll damn near prove to the UK, including me, that he's no longer interested in being a serious artist. I really, really hope he has more sense than to do it.

 

And I think he does have sense.

"Serious artist." What is a serious artist anyway? If you mean, a class act, Mika has tons of class. He's a much better singer than anyone else who's current, and a better songwriter. That's not going to change.

Andrew Lloyd Webber's reputation didn't suffer because of Eurovision. He didn't sing of course, but then ALW can't sing to save his life, so someone else did it. We didn't win, but we didn't do too badly.

If Mika decides to go for it, I just think we should just trust and support him. It could get him back on top, especially if he wins, and get him more sales of his album and singles. That's all we want to happen at the end of the day. ESC could really help him with that, and if he does well, the UK will be eating-their-words. That would be very good indeed.

[Marilyn Mastin]

What is Mika going to prove to the UK by abstaining from Eurovision? As far as most people are concerned he disappeared 5 years ago. All you had to do was read the comments on the coming out articles. Some people didn't even know who he was. Today's teenagers were children the last time Mika was on the radio.

 

If I was in a position to advise him I would not advise him to do it. But I guess that's my own cultural bias because I don't relate to mainland European popular culture. I also think this is all a rumour and a moot point. But if the rumour was true then it would be a done deal and you just have to look at the good points.

 

It sounds to me like the lack of credibility with this competition is the crap quality of the songs and participants and it also sounds like it has gone through cycles throughout its lifetime. So some years are better than others and maybe having someone like Mika who is respected in countries like France will lift Eurovision up rather than drag Mika down.

 

Is it going to give him credibility in the UK? Perhaps not. But what is? No one is paying any attention to him. Is everyone saying they prefer him to disappear in obscurity than to embarrass them by being a noticeable participant in Eurovision? I don't get it.

Sorry to double post, but I agree so much with you. If Mika was selling out the O2 in London and the MEN in Manchester. If his songs were #1 and his album too, I'd say he doesn't need Eurovision.

But the fact is, as you say, no one is bothering to play his songs. Many people don't even know him if they weren't fans in 2007. He's lucky to sell out a tiny venue. As far as I'm concerned, the only way is up. He just can't get any further down. Yet he's too good to disappear forever. He should go for it.

[Droopsy]

I wouldn't mind either way. From what I've read on MFC over the last few months, even years, he isn't popular in the UK to begin with. Like Marilyn says, how could it get even worse then?

 

Other than that I totally agree with DerMoment1608 about the fact that countries should complain less and focus their attention more on sending entries that are actually decent and will appeal to the masses. Rybak, Loreen, Lena (even if not my taste...) are great examples of this. I'm looking forward to ESC. With or (most likely) without Mika.

[RAK1]

Yet we read things like that about him Twitter: @NME: The Brit Awards' 10 worst decisions ever http://www.nme.com/blog/index.php?blog=1&p=11880&title=the_brit_awards_10_worst_decisions_ever&more=1&c=1&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=britawardsblog

 

And that's because the NME, who are an indie based music magazine, have always been up their own backsides. What annoys me about their comments is, that the Breakthrough artist is voted by the listeners of R1, who that year loved Mika (but then that was when Jo Whiley, Sara Cox and Scott Mills were top djs there, it's changed drastically since then), and also the other artists there also not exactly high flying in the charts at the moment. Kate Nash and The Klaxons also seemed to disappear, Bat For Lashes has a steady fanbase, but she only plays small venues,and Leona Lewis is moderately successful, but not exactly setting the charts alight here lately.

The problem with the UK music industry at the moment is unless you've been on X Factor as a contestant, are an indie band, or a dance act, the majority of music mags (Q are the only exception here), and radio stations (R2 the exception here), aren't interested in you, and sadly the record buying public seem to follow them like sheep.

[kath]

I just think it's worth him trying. He would get mentioned in the UK again, and even if people make fun of him, that's still publicity, and Mika himself has said he doesn't mind what people say, if they are talking about him.

From the time he released BG in the UK, people stopped taking him seriously. Now he's being ignored as a has-been. What's he got to loose?

We on here know how great he is, and how gorgeous. He's no longer the goofy-looking guy who sang GK, he's a total hottie! The UK need to see him now and fall for him!

Celebs do all kinds of things in the UK to save their careers. They eat kangaroo-whatsits in the jungle, they fall on their butts on the ice, they go in Celeb Big Brother, or become a judge on X Factor or The Voice, or BGT.

What's wrong with Mika in Eurovision? Of course, its his choice, but if he chooses to do it I can't see it doing anything but good. I don't think for a minute he'd come last. Europe love him too much for that and we'd have a great song! It would be great, but it's up to him in the end, if he does it of not.

 

But Mika has never done things to 'save his career'. He is no more likely to go on one of those rediculous 'celebrity' shows than fly to the moon.

 

But I do agree with you about the voting. To be honest, a competition where the UK are unable to vote for Mika but the rest of Europe can may not be a bad idea.

 

But as Christine says - by now it will be a done deal. Whoever is representing the UK will have been chosen ages ago - we will just have to wait and see.

 

What is Mika going to prove to the UK by abstaining from Eurovision? As far as most people are concerned he disappeared 5 years ago. All you had to do was read the comments on the coming out articles. Some people didn't even know who he was. Today's teenagers were children the last time Mika was on the radio.

 

If I was in a position to advise him I would not advise him to do it. But I guess that's my own cultural bias because I don't relate to mainland European popular culture. I also think this is all a rumour and a moot point. But if the rumour was true then it would be a done deal and you just have to look at the good points.

 

It sounds to me like the lack of credibility with this competition is the crap quality of the songs and participants and it also sounds like it has gone through cycles throughout its lifetime. So some years are better than others and maybe having someone like Mika who is respected in countries like France will lift Eurovision up rather than drag Mika down.

 

Is it going to give him credibility in the UK? Perhaps not. But what is? No one is paying any attention to him. Is everyone saying they prefer him to disappear in obscurity than to embarrass them by being a noticeable participant in Eurovision? I don't get it.

 

No, I don't think it is a case of embarrassing us. I just think it is a case of the ESC having such a poor reputation................and add that to how poorly Mika is perceived here it just doesn't seem like a very good combination. I agree that it has gone through cycles - but it certainly isn't going through a very good phase at the moment.

 

It would certainly raise his profile. It would give him airplay. There is the possibility that if it went well it could do him a lot of good. But it's a gamble and it's one which I personally would be much happier if he didn't take,

[kath]

And that's because the NME, who are an indie based music magazine, have always been up their own backsides.

 

 

+1

[Christine]

No, I don't think it is a case of embarrassing us. I just think it is a case of the ESC having such a poor reputation................and add that to how poorly Mika is perceived here it just doesn't seem like a very good combination.

 

But as you say the Brits will not be voting for him so what difference does it make? What's the worst that can happen? More derogatory articles about him and then...what?

 

I agree that it has gone through cycles - but it certainly isn't going through a very good phase at the moment.

 

Yes but something has to start it on the upswing. Mika's always been the trendsetter (or at least gotten in on the ground floor of the trend) so you never know.

 

It would certainly raise his profile. It would give him airplay. There is the possibility that if it went well it could do him a lot of good. But it's a gamble and it's one which I personally would be much happier if he didn't take,

 

I still don't understand what it is that he is meant to be gambling. His reputation in the UK...?

 

If Mika doesn't want to do it I totally understand. Like I said this is not my cultural reference so I don't get it anymore than I get the "comedy" of the Elle Me Dit video. It all seems absurd to me but if 100 million people are watching it it doesn't really matter what I think.

 

If it was something he wanted to do it would be pretty sad if he let some mockery by the British press put him off. Although I suppose he may look towards representing another country.

[IngievV]

He should have been a judge on the Voice. Pretty sure that would have given his career a massive boost.

[Christine]

He should have been a judge on the Voice. Pretty sure that would have given his career a massive boost.

 

He should have mentored on Canadian Idol too when he had the chance.

 

People slag off all these shows but when has it ever hurt anyone's career? I mean really?

 

The only thing that puts me off the Eurovision thing is that obviously I'd rather see Mika doing acoustic gigs around North America than focusing on Eurocentric stuff that doesn't have a lot to do with his own music. I can't relate to it and I'd rather he was making his own albums and touring and giving North America a shot. But what I'd rather see and what is most likely to pay off for him are not necessarily the same thing.

[RAK1]

He should have been a judge on the Voice. Pretty sure that would have given his career a massive boost.

 

It's a pity all the judges in the UK version are coming back, after rumours a couple of them wouldn't be. I think that would have been a boost to his profile. Although I'm not a fan of X Factor, The Voice isn't as bad, as it's not about sad back stories, they focus on the singing properly. I think Mika might have done alright on there, Didn't do Danny from The Script any harm, they've had a resurgence since he started judging on there.