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I am glad you brought this up again because to me disliking this version doesn't have anything to do with 'American' music. I mean, most genres in popular music cone from America, so that, in itself is a contradiction. Also, nowadays mainstream pop music is pretty much global with influences from many countries and sub-genres that change rapidly. In an earlier post I mentioned some American pop musicians sharing the same songwriting teams who actually revive early 90's Europop / Swedish pop with them, with the audience not even noticing. There are now international teams working with global artists like Madonna, for example, and the music is pretty much the mix of many influences, in most cases trying to follow latest trends.

If one's taste starts and ends with the lyrics and music to 'Baby' (Bieber) I am not judging them but the end product does reveal a particular mindset formed by different factors I mentioned earlier, among them age, culture and gender. I'd find it rather surprising if that matched Justin's own taste , so I supposed he has songs written for him with limited input coming from him. I don't necessarily mean he is a sellout vs himself but a sellout artist by definition, meaning something like 'fake' / not using his songs to express himself. Him possibly having his own vision about where his career is heading to does not make him an artist, even though one may argue even the design of a hamburger box is art as any judgement on art is subjective. I don't think that evaluating art and especially music is as subjective as some may claim. Certainly not within the same or similar cultural context. Western music has clearly defined structural concepts that one may not be able to explain but most would hear it. How one judges music depends on those gender-age-education-culture...etc factors and that's where the question of the target audience gets into the picture. I am pretty certain that there isn't much overlap between even potential fans of Ariana/Bieber and Mika , for example , but Mika's record company does not seem to understand that (not talking only about this duet, just in general, about the way he has been positioned in the last 4-5 years). I wonder if Mika can see the difference between his 2007 audience vs who he has now - not talking about the figures only. A lack of direction seems to me to be one if his biggest problems.

Well, I have seen posts here denying that Mika is motivated by appealing to an audience since he is only motivated by expressing himself with his ' art' ... I can clearly see a difference between Bieber and Mika in terms of artistic integrity. It is my view, of course, but I can't hear Bieber being 'present' in his songs (the ones I saw on tv,anyway), since they all sound plain, full of cliches and with no personality at all - totally commodified. In Mika's case the lyrics tend to reveal personal thoughts, the melody often has some characteristic Mika style elements, like octave jumps, and the arrangements are usually more complex than plain chart music. In other words, Mika's musical signature is in his songs. Or at least in most of them. So Bieber is a sellout Mika is not. IMO, of course I only questioned Mika's motivations with certain simple lyrics and radio-friendly arrangements (that never worked though) twice: with the lead singles of his last two albums. They sounded too artificial and non-Mika to me, but looking back he may have simply tried too hard and failed as with him trying to comply with the standard never works. He should have realised it by now. I don't understand it, either. One common strategy worked for the first album because it was so good it stood out from the rest everywhere and his image was less confusing, more the 'boy next door' image rather than the Louboutin wearing exclusive pop star type.

I can't quote now so, some thoughts on what I read in the last pages. I am not surprised at all by the fans of this girl not mentioning the composer of the song at all. I have never seen fans of Katy Perry, Adam Lambert, Kelly Clarkson or Pink acknowledging the awesome work of Dr Luke, for example. Authorship on pop music is mixed, merged and difficult to define. Besides, there is no way Mika will ever get recognised as the composer this song simply because he did not write it. On the sell-out note, I don't think that this case can be compared to Mika's engagement to directly target certain audiences - whether that be the French, the Italian or the US audience. Selling out means that one sacrifices their artistic integrity (i.e. making compromises they would have never done if relying on their own taste alone), and I think the French songs are all very much Mika, whether one likes them or not. Concerning this record, as I understand it is not his own product (can someone check production credits, please) so it can't be a case of him 'selling out' , just doing a favour his record company must have asked him to do. As long as he keeps his distance from it, like he seems to be doing, most of his fans will never even hear about it, so no further disappointment, only some interest in him coming from some young US fans. A win-win situation for both singers at a point where Mika has nothing to lose anymore.

It seems that some people on this forum have never heard of literary criticism, let alone one in music, so some help: 'the intellectual activity of formulating judgments on the value and degree of excellence of individual works of music, or whole groups or genres' Most posts on this thread are about liking or disliking this particular version of the song, whilst the rest are about disliking how others are disliking the song. This song has been re-mixed to fit kids' taste. Ariana is a Disney star so that is understandable. Why would anyone need to defend themselves for having a different taste? I find it totally ridiculous for anyone to start preaching how 'artists' should never be criticized and all works should be respected...etc. This is not a kindergarden where you pat a child on the head and congratulate them for drawing three lines. It is a forum for adults who may have their own opinion on things they see and hear. The same song recorded by two different artists (even in the SAME genre, like in this case) may affect people differently depending on age, gender, culture and aesthetics that is closely related to their intellect and current emotional state..etc. , no-one can be expected to clap for something they can't stand listening to.

When it comes to music for kids from I have the following memories from my childhood (even back then I tended to note which country films / children's stories were from): Jamie and the Magic Torch - I loved the song and the visuals of the theme song but never liked any of the tales themselves: I found them really boring. I still think the music is great: [YOUTUBE]KeMMow_Itqw[/YOUTUBE] ...and The Muppet Show - I just couldn't get enough of it:teehee: [YOUTUBE]9THwnQg-vEw[/YOUTUBE]

yes, true, like the last one in my first post is also not an original but borrowed from a classical piece. I guess I was thinking more about movie soundtracks nowadays in general when I wrote that - not sure anymore - it is becoming rare to have music written directly for films Oh they are great and funny, just like the one that was posted from Sweden It reminds me the short intro to 'TV GYM' we had over here from sixties to the eighties: there was 5 mins of gymnastic excercises shown here before the time of children's 15 mins of fairy tales every night - you may find this hilarious . [YOUTUBE]t8bt4UUDavo[/YOUTUBE] Actually, my favourite cartoons used to be ones that were watched by adults as well due to their witty language and story. Perhaps something similar to the Flintstones. I have never watched that one in English as we had in dubbed but not simply translated but written in proper verse and with the voices of really good actors. Anyway, same writer as the one translating the Flintstones wrote similar stories (parts in witty and humorous verse) for children and adults young at heart and the title tracks are also funny and loved here: Doctor Bubó [YOUTUBE]jqFXc8ueChI[/YOUTUBE] Mézga family - I think this was shown in some neighbouring countries as well [YOUTUBE]qbAD73bT2eg[/YOUTUBE]

yes, that's great news. I personally wouldn't be able to list 55 other albums that were released in 2012 though.

oh, I have been waiting for the Russian songs. I really like the last one you linked but I am missing my favourite: Чебура́шка - so I am adding it. I still feel really nostalgic when listening to it even though I never even saw the story, only know this song I learned at school when I was around 12. [YOUTUBE]y3GEmK0MJtI[/YOUTUBE]

Checked out some more links now.. @Lilasko we also say kex for biscuits, just spell it differently This Pippi character seems to be well-known in many countries. THe story comes from a Swedish writer it seems are you sure? (check link) I can vaguely recall this animated film beling shown in Hungary as well. All I remember is that it starts with Bach's music though. I found it grandious. The theme of the Spanish animated movie @LeiRe posted reminded me of one of the most popular Hungarian animated film about a little fox called Vuk. The title track is this one, sang by the daughter of the composer who is my age now: [YOUTUBE]LIkoPpvw22g[/YOUTUBE]

oh, I love how many responses this thread has had already. I will listen to each of the posts and may respond to some - I am already thrilled by after the first 2 posts I have read so far: The beginning is ragtime music - I really like that. We also many children songs written for tv series - this is the proper way of doing a film or a series: having music written for it rather than borrowing songs written for something /someone else. We also had Maya the bee over here, I think, but I never watched it as I was already older by then. So Karel Gott was popular in Germany, too? We have a Hungarian version of Lady Karneval from him. I have just checked the composer of the song and it turns out to be the same guy: Karel Svoboda. Anyone from Czechia here? Didn't he also write the music for the series 'Hospital at the end of the City'?I really liked that music and his name sounds familiar, like I saw it back then in the credits. Oh, I didn't know these were shown in other countries as well. We had this series as well. I didn't know it came from Yugoslavia. This is beautiful. I love children choirs, especially when they sing in multiple part harmony. This classical pience from Russian composer Prokofiev may be the first ever musical children's story. (from early last century) We learned about instruments by listening to this at school when I was around 8-9. Never heard of Bowie and Sting being involved in filming this until around 5 years ago .. It is still being used in a lot of ads, like last year one for Coke.

Following Mika’s kid-friendly version of Popular I googled for some other songs children are listening to nowadays and I had this idea to collect children’s music from different countries. The reason behind is that when I as young children listened to music composed to them by adults rather than listening to child-friendly versions of adult songs. So we’d better collect these before they disappear. I do love them. I have favourite ones from other countries as well but of course I’ll start with my childhood – no Hungarian speaking ones in the first post though so that I don’t scare anyone away. The first one is the title track of a cartoon that includes no talking at all even during the story. Bunny with chequred ears - music written in the 70s by a contemporary Hungarian composer [YOUTUBE]cn754Xz-lQ8[/YOUTUBE] The next one is the title track of a folk tale series watched by adults and kids alike here – composed by a folk- rock band. [YOUTUBE]6htgqDQtl9U[/YOUTUBE] The theme of the last fairy tale is a Gavotte (dance) by a classical French composer called Gossec but it was transcribed to xilophone, which I love and really fits the story about a tiny little green pig [YOUTUBE]vxUoJ0rSlcE&playnext=1&list=PL69D807799F2F38D5&feature=results_main[/YOUTUBE] I hope you all share some favourites from your childhood.

@Pandora_Z First of all I'd like to let you know that when I asked you about the reason you were upset about the perceived 'anti-American' comments I did not even notice them on the thread. Now I have and I think you have every right to be upset. However, I think it is best to quote in such cases and discuss that with the individual themselves, I really don't think it is the right message to ask people to just keep quiet in case a particular group turns up on the forum. There is no reason to discuss gardening, either,but it is still being discussed. There is freedom of speech here and if someone comes up with an interesting topic people respond. Politics have ALWAYS been discussed on MFC, usually as random comments. I remember some heated debates about abortion, the Roman Catholic church and religion following a blog by Mika in an Italian magazine, for example. You will also find threads dedicated to politics, such as: Let's talk POLITICS ( NO FIGHTS) - started by a fan in Chicago http://www.mikafanclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11653&highlight=politics (American) Politics and Racism - started by a fan from NYC - one of the most intelligent and original members of this forum ever http://www.mikafanclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13819&highlight=politics Mika combines politics and camp at LA show - that is obviously about Mika getting involved in US politics http://www.mikafanclub.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12941&highlight=politics ...I centainly don't think it belongs to this thread though. That supposes that my happiness is dependent on Mika's happiness and I don't feel that close attachment with him, actually. I'd be happy for him but as for my personal happiness I'd rather released or sang something I actually liked. PS: I have just created a thread for children's music from different countries. I think it should be a really interesting one with many great, original songs. http://www.mikafanclub.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3855186#post3855186

Perhaps you don't but others might I mean, even though this time I did not even say a word about politics, especially not US poilitics it would be interesting to know why it would hurt people since they are not directly responsible for any of it and may even be opposing some of the ideas themselves. For example, anyone can form an opinion about the policies of my country, I can always explain some more background to it if I can.In fact, I'd be happy to do so because I find it embarrassing. If one says they don't like a song but Mika is 'allowed' to release it/ he had good intentions with it / he seems happy to perform it (some examples I have heard over the years ) I tend to call this listening with one's heart rather than with one's ears. That's what I meant. Lollipop is an adult song, it is only a nursery rhyme to the superficial listener. The difference between this version and Mika's original is in the arrangements : the new version is simpler and easier to process, that is why it appeals to a younger generation. Just because I say that gummy bears are for kids it does not mean that adults don't consumer them but it is still predominantly kids. @Micah Thanks for sharing your perspective on this. It was interesting to read what you, the 'apparent target audience' . Your 10-year old sister is pretty wise as well. I think she is right.

oh did he? I thought that simply the rap part that was cut out and the girl now sings something else. - Typical of me: so shocked by the arrangement not even paying attention to the lyrics. Here it is the opposite. Nudity on tv was allowed here even during the tightly controlled years but it was always for 'artistic' reasons (typically in Hungarian and French films). So when the communist regime fell and nudity for the sake of nudity started to appear in the media it was not controlled at all first, only at a later stage, probably because we simply had no rules for differentiating between 'artistic' and 'commercial' nudity. So now they fall into the same category. In the nineties we could watch all the videos that were censored in America in full. Even now we do. Yes, it is self-censorship. Obviously, if one records for Disney they are going to watch their words not because they have to but because they are addressing a teen or even younger audience. It is not an artistic compromise but a choice: a choice to market your song to that audience.

A listener judges the outcome not Mika himself. I think that is pretty much the norm for those who rely on their ears when forming an opinion about a performance. I really don't think that was a conscious decision. They could have simply asked to use Mika's already recorded vocals. oh, I remember that now. It can be hurtful to read criticism of laws and regulations from one's own country. At the same time, it can also be an eye-opener. It would be good to discuss this with people who actually live there - perhaps on another thread though.

Did people mention anything against America here? just because I think Nicky Minaj looks and sounds cheap to me, I don’t apply it to the whole American music scene There are similar type of artists in Europe I don’t like, either. When I think about great American music I think of composers like Gershwin, Berlin, Sondheim, Rogers and Hammerstein and any other original Disney composers, Little Richard, Ray Charles, Bob Dylan, Paul Simon..etc and acts like Michael Jackson, Guns n’ Roses, Blondie, Aretha Franklin as well as even early Madonna and Lady Gaga. In this case, most people’s sentiments can be explained by the fact that a great Mika song has been ruined. It has nothing to do with American music. It only means that some wise businessmen thought that this song (the most popular one from the album in the US) would be a perfect addition to that young girl’s portfolio. They seem to have borrowed tunes from other artists as well. It is definitely more convenient to borrow already popular tunes than try to come up with them. It is not about exclusivity. It is about musical taste that can’t be taught or explained. It is defined by one’s culture, age, education and exposure to different types of music. The more types of music one listens to the more expectations they have. Mika’s fanbase has very little common with that of Ariana, anyone can see that and I don’t think anyone should be called a brat just because they don’t share the same taste with 12-year old girls.

I’d rather he just kept quiet about it. Like @Silver, one listen was perfectly enough for me, no further tries needed. I honestly don’t see the situation that tragic. Mika did NOT have to go to the studio for his vocals to be used on this record, so I am not ‘worried’ about Mika’s taste turning that bad. Someone wrote earlier that Mika’s reputation as a composer may suffer but of course it won’t, since he merely re-wrote the lyrics to an already popular Broadway song and made an awesome version with Priscilla that has completely the opposite meaning to the original song. That meaning is something the producers of this version completely neglected, or don’t even understand themselves, as they gave them to the mouth of this Disney princess. It’s not that her audience, young little girls will start wondering about the meaning, anyway. Or perhaps it is now trendy to be an outsider now. It does not work like that. If record company controls what he puts on an album they will insist on similar stuff from him if that’s what they see is selling from him. I think his record company is already in the false belief that it is fast, happy, silly songs that sell best when it comes to Mika, that’s why they chose to release Celebrate as the first single everywhere. Anyway, the reason I quoted you is because there were other similar post ‘allowing’ Mika to make this admittedly bad choice or even sell his soul should it help his career, but at the same time, often the same people (and not talking about you) totally oppose the slightest bit of criticism about even unreleased songs he can actually work on further, following fans’ feedback. To me that is a total lack of aesthetics and blindly approving anything as soon as Mika himself has done it. I hope he does it – can’t wait for opinions to change all of a sudden

Totally... And some of them seem to be on MFC already..

I heard Underwater in the Hungarian version of The Voice and even today on a liberal radio station that the current government has been trying to 'ban' for over a year now. I was really pleased to hear it at both occasions, and especially the second one as that station (that is not a music radio station at all) only plays 'classic' songs and sounds, like Piaf, the Beatles or jazz..etc, so it seems that Underwater has passed their test. ( Other than these I have never heard anything from the album anywhere else in Hungary)

OMG what's this? Glee? Listening to the mix on the second link of the first post. Edit: ok, first link is the same or similar. How can I get an impression from a short audio that the song is sung by a brainless chick who has no clue what she is singing about?

Thank you for the video, Deb! It is his best message to his fans, as far as I can recall. Glad you all had a great time there. PS: I really liked the pictures you tweeted as well, so I already have Iceland in my spring / summer travel plan.

Thank you for explaining it. There are always so many vague references going around on MFC that I have a feeling that everyone takes everything personally as they can only refer to their own experience. Also, some people interpret others expressing their dislike of a song as a personal offense to Mika, whilst others are referring to something most of us are not aware of. I never read the replies to @mikasounds on twitter (not even my own, except I get a notification if a follower sends me something ) so I don't know but I can imagine how vicious some people can be. If someone is so sick that their whole life consists of sending spite to Mika or even MFC via twitter, YT or FB, I don't think it is even worth mentioning it here as in my opinion, ignorance is the most powerful tool against sick people wrapped in their own dark world.

I don't remember reading that but I haven't read all posts. I think on that one you have to remember that there are a lot of non-native speakers here who may have a different understanding of how that word is used in English or lack the understanding of the subtleness in wording. Also, there is a 'trend' on MFC in general to call Mika a liar right away when there is some contradiction in what he says now vs what he said before. To me it only reveals the lack of understanding how that PR works in general or how Mika can play with words and / or the press. I actually find many of Mika's 'coloured' stories and euphemisms pretty entertaining

Obviously at m&gs one needs to keep it short and is most likely to simply ask for an autograph, thank for the concert or say something silly, rather than start talking about choices Mika has made for the show. However, can you think of examples on this forum that you think one shouldn't say to Mika, should they have the opportunity to get him engaged in a longer discussion? (Besides confronting him about cancelled gigs, of course , as that is totally pointless.) Respecting an artist does not equal blindly loving anything he does and I think grown up people should not be intimidated by expessing their opinions. I remember that in Italy someone told him that they didn't agree with Celebrate being the first single and he replied that he was aware of that and he was also talking about the record company making decisions on singles..etc. I actually believe that THIS was one of the most positive feedbacks he could ever get as it was honest, turned out to be totally well-founded (lack of success everywhere) and he could use the learnings for the next album. So perhaps (some) fans have a better understanding on what works for him vs leaving it to his team / the record company. Having 'yes' men around is pretty convenient for a while until one realizes that they are heading for a fall. He is not a child not to be able to handle fans' feedback.