origin of love Origin of Love - Song and Lyrics Discussion

[basicamenteyo]

I felt the same way about UW too, but to me it seems that he changed the last minute of the song? Now it's much more enjoyable. I recommend you listen to it at Deferiantes or Tallin.

 

Timing!! I tried to watch that vid this morning. But I got bored before the first minute and closed the window

 

And yes,I feel bad for it. But... I dont know. Maybe it happens to me with this song as happened with OMS. I hated it,then I saw it live,and almost died. Who knows? But at the moment.... no.

[Sephira]

I love this song Like others this song make me little think to a song from the 90's that I can't remember

 

But something disturbs me in the lyrics because I know the Bible I never read in the Genesis something which could make think to that lyrics :

"Used to be Adam and Eve they found their love in a tree

God didn't think they deserved it

He taught them hate taught them pride

Gave them a leaf made them hide

Switched their stories aside"

 

I become boring for some persons may be for all of you but in Genesis 2,2 it refered to Adam and Eve "That is why a man leaves his father and mother and attaches to his wife and the two become one. Both were naked, the man and his wife, but they had no feeling of shame". I don't have to describe what it happens between them but they were not kicked out of Heaven by God for this reason

In the Genesis 2,3 it is explain that they were kicked out of paradise because they ate the fruit of the tree that gives knowledge of good and evil, they can no longer live forever in paradise as they can do evil. They are embarrassed to be naked because they lost their innocence but it has nothing to do with sex or love

[basicamenteyo]

I love this song Like others this song make me little think to a song from the 90's that I can't remember

 

But something disturbs me in the lyrics because I know the Bible I never read in the Genesis something which could make think to that lyrics :

"Used to be Adam and Eve they found their love in a tree

God didn't think they deserved it

He taught them hate taught them pride

Gave them a leaf made them hide

Switched their stories aside"

 

I become boring for some persons may be for all of you but in Genesis 2,2 it refered to Adam and Eve "That is why a man leaves his father and mother and attaches to his wife and the two become one. Both were naked, the man and his wife, but they had no feeling of shame". I don't have to describe what it happens between them but they were not kicked out of Heaven by God for this reason

In the Genesis 2,3 it is explain that they were kicked out of paradise because they ate the fruit of the tree that gives knowledge of good and evil, they can no longer live forever in paradise as they can do evil. They are embarrassed to be naked because they lost their innocence but it has nothing to do with sex or love

 

For me they used sex just to have fun and not to procreate as Church proclaims. Fhats why they were punished. Bible is odd enough and each one has his own interpretation of it...

[qwurtie]

'Switched their stories aside' - I think it's 'let's push their stories aside'

[w-lil]

'Switched their stories aside' - I think it's 'let's push their stories aside'

 

I hear that too.. but with my french ears i'm never sure!

[suzie]

'Switched their stories aside' - I think it's 'let's push their stories aside'

 

I hear that, too.

[Lilasko]

I now I've said that I don't understand peoples hype about the song, but I guess I have to eat my own words. After listening to the "Estonian version" I'm mesmerized, in love, addicted, I can keep on going but I'm pretty sure you've got the point.

 

The origin of love, is one of the best songs so far

[egita]

I hope the next track by track will be for TOOL..!

[Marilyn Mastin]

I love this song Like others this song make me little think to a song from the 90's that I can't remember

 

But something disturbs me in the lyrics because I know the Bible I never read in the Genesis something which could make think to that lyrics :

"Used to be Adam and Eve they found their love in a tree

God didn't think they deserved it

He taught them hate taught them pride

Gave them a leaf made them hide

Switched their stories aside"

 

I become boring for some persons may be for all of you but in Genesis 2,2 it refered to Adam and Eve "That is why a man leaves his father and mother and attaches to his wife and the two become one. Both were naked, the man and his wife, but they had no feeling of shame". I don't have to describe what it happens between them but they were not kicked out of Heaven by God for this reason

In the Genesis 2,3 it is explain that they were kicked out of paradise because they ate the fruit of the tree that gives knowledge of good and evil, they can no longer live forever in paradise as they can do evil. They are embarrassed to be naked because they lost their innocence but it has nothing to do with sex or love

I too am a Christian and a leader of worship. There are actually two main interpretations of the Adam and Eve story.

One is that it is basically, exactly as it was written. Satan appeared as a snake, goaded Eve into taking the apple. She took it to Adam and they both ate. They no longer had the innocence of children, realised they were nude. God realised what they'd done and they could no longer stay in Paradise.

 

The other interpretation is that the story is a metaphore. That the taking the apple is metophoric, and that they actually had sex.

 

Bearing in mind he's talking about the RC church, I think Mika is going by that second interpretation. The RC church (as I've experienced because I grew up in it) is very backward about sex. They almost think of it as dirty (maybe it's changed in some places by now. I really hope so) but from what I remember and am aware of, sex is to get children. They're not encouraged to use condoms or anthing to stop pregnancy.

So I think Mika is using the metaphoric approach. I'm not going to say if I think he's right or wrong. That's not my place to contradict another human being. But the only thing I think is sad, is that he says, "God taught them hate, taught them pride." God is love. The Devil is hate. I hope one day he'll understand how much God loves him.

Edited July 14, 2012 by Marilyn Mastin

[suzie]

I'm not going to say if I think he's right or wrong. That's not my place to contradict another human being. But the only thing I think is sad, is that he says, "God taught them hate, taught them pride." God is love. The Devil is hate. I hope one day he'll understand how much God loves him.

 

I don't think Mika fears God at all, to begin with as he does not seem to believe in all the teachings of the RC church. In the song Mika seems to question God's 'right' / ability to determine what is right and wrong since God himself preaches hatred instead of acceptance. To me, the song is about the invividual's ability to find their own values and eventually, find 'God' / the origin of love in themselves and other human beings.

 

I think the Latin part would be crucial to understand the exact meaning as there must be at least one word there as a clue but since no-one can understand it properly at the moment, we'll have to wait with that.

Edited July 14, 2012 by suzie

[Marilyn Mastin]

I don't think Mika fears God at all, to begin with as he does not seem to believe in all the teachings of the RC church. In the song Mika seems to question God's 'right' / ability to determine what is right and wrong since God himself preaches hatred instead of acceptance. To me, the song is about the invividual's ability to find their own values and eventually, find 'God' / the origin of love in themselves.

 

I think the Latin part would be crucial to understand the exact meaning as there must be at least one word there as a clue but since no-one can understand it properly at the moment, we'll have to wait with that.

I love Mika's message in the song, about us all being "LOVE" which we all are. We start by loving who we are as individuals, accepting anything about ourselves that people might not understand, or criticize us for. Then we can extend that love to others.

I do believe that Mika does have faith, but is not into religious rules and predjudices. He's right there. There's nothing more predjudiced that a religious person who quotes rules and regulations, but does not leave room for mercy, forgiveness, or the fact that we all, as people on this Earth, are forever changing and growing, even if we are 100 years old.

I'm not the same person I was as a teenager, or as a young mum.

Speaking only for myself, and for no one else, I left the RC church after a priest had made it clear to me that if I got married, I would be expected to have as many children as God saw fit to give me. I would also not be able to deny my husband his "rights", but basically, have sex and have kids.

I am disabled, but that didn't matter to him. So I left the church.

I managed to have one child after Alan and I got married, but it was a terrible struggle. I'd never not have had my beautiful boy. He's the best son a mother could have, but I couldn't have coped with any more. Alan had a vascectomy, so I would not have to.

That is my story. I hope it's different now, for others.

Just briefly, about the gay issue with most churches. Yes Leviticus says it's an abomination, but it also says many other things are too. But no one bothers about the other stuff. Even disobeying your parents is an abomination. But the word abomination, didn't mean what it does today. It wasn't so drastic.

My personal view is that a person doesn't choose to be gay. Men and women have killed themselves, or hated themselves, or lived in a sham marraige that was no good to anybody, or got thrown in Jail for being gay. No one would choose any of that. So I firmly believe (as Gaga would say) they're born that way. If someone asked me to snog a woman, I couldn't do it, so I understand it has to be part of the make-up of the person, and no one should need to hide part of themselves to conform to what their church, or any other person, want them to be.

So I am happy for any gay or bi person, if they find happiness. Good luck, and God bless them.

[suzie]

@Marilyn it is admirable how you did not not lose your faith in religion after the uneducated advice of that priest.

 

There is a clear difference between religion and the church as the latter (meaning the community that practices a particular religion) consists of indivuduals who try to interpret the teachings of a religion and that, by definition, can be rather subjective and open to a lot of misinterpretation.

 

I love Mika's message in the song, about us all being "LOVE" which we all are. We start by loving who we are as individuals, accepting anything about ourselves that people might not understand, or criticize us for. Then we can extend that love to others.

Yes, I totally agree, very well-worded. In fact, I'll re-phase my earlier post. I meant finding 'God' in ourselves and others.

Edited July 14, 2012 by suzie

[basicamenteyo]

Id like to comment something. Im glad we know that God and what Church calls Fod is different. To begin with,Bible is a from the beginning a bad translation. Jesus spoke "arameo" (sorry dont know the word in English) and every "document" from that time was written in that language. The word "Adam" is the nominative/neuter/plural that "arameo" used to say "humanity". So,in the original "document" someone wrote: "and God created adam" as in "God created the humans". So,starting from that,obviously someone did a bad translation from the very beginning and then needed to make up a whole story to go on.

[Marilyn Mastin]

Id like to comment something. Im glad we know that God and what Church calls Fod is different. To begin with,Bible is a from the beginning a bad translation. Jesus spoke "arameo" (sorry dont know the word in English) and every "document" from that time was written in that language. The word "Adam" is the nominative/neuter/plural that "arameo" used to say "humanity". So,in the original "document" someone wrote: "and God created adam" as in "God created the humans". So,starting from that,obviously someone did a bad translation from the very beginning and then needed to make up a whole story to go on.

Yes, a lot of people hold to the MANKIND (ADAM) WOMANKIND (EVE) theory. I'm open minded about that, but I agree about the Bible translations, as it's originally a foreign text, God inspired, but translated by man. Some Hebrew words have more than one meaning, so when it's translated by a person, or persons, they are going to choose the word that suits themselves. I think that's why the document contradicts itself so much.

Here's an interesting example of a translation that possibly was a mistake.

There is a theory that between the 1st and 2nd verses of Genesis, there was actually a gap of, possibly millions of years, during wiich time, Satan was banished to Earth and the Earth BECAME without form or void. But the Bible actually says WAS without form or void, because the word could be translated either way, but that way makes a smooth transition between the time God created Heaven and Earth, to the time he decided to make it habitable, with no time inbetween. It's a neat and tidy package.

But The Gap Theory, as it is termed, makes a lot of sense if we think of it. There are fossils that are millions of years old, yet the Bible doesn't go back that far. It makes sense that the Earth was already there, made ages ago, but it got wrecked, so God did a DIY job and fixed the planet, finally putting us there within the space of six days.

Anyway, that is an interesting concept and I personally, think it's right. It explains the obvious age of the actual planet, and we have only been on the surface for a very short time.

Oh dear: Mika does provoke some big discussions on here doesn't he!

Edited July 14, 2012 by Marilyn Mastin

[lollipop161]

:thumb_yello:The word "Adam" is a Hebrew source. It's still in our lexicon, when we wanna say "man" for example, and also people are called "Adam". Or when we wanna say "a human being" we say "Ben - Adam" ("Ben"= child, boy, offspring)

btw, Eve in Hebrew is called "Hava"

[basicamenteyo]

Yes, a lot of people hold to the MANKIND (ADAM) WOMANKIND (EVE) theory. I'm open minded about that, but I agree about the Bible translations, as it's originally a foreign text, God inspired, but translated by man. Some Hebrew words have more than one meaning, so when it's translated by a person, or persons, they are going to choose the word that suits themselves. I think that's why the document contradicts itself so much.

Here's an interesting example of a translation that possibly was a mistake.

There is a theory that between the 1st and 2nd verses of Genesis, there was actually a gap of, possibly millions of years, during wiich time, Satan was banished to Earth and the Earth BECAME without form or void. But the Bible actually says WAS without form or void, because the word could be translated either way, but that way makes a smooth transition between the time God created Heaven and Earth, to the time he decided to make it habitable, with no time inbetween. It's a neat and tidy package.

But The Gap Theory, as it is termed, makes a lot of sense if we think of it. There are fossils that are millions of years old, yet the Bible doesn't go back that far. It makes sense that the Earth was already there, made ages ago, but it got wrecked, so God did a DIY job and fixed the planet, finally putting us there within the space of six days.

Anyway, that is an interesting concept and I personally, think it's right. It explains the obvious age of the actual planet, and we have only been on the surface for a very short time.

Oh dear: Mika does provoke some big discussions on here doesn't he!

 

LOL he does. I dont trust in what Church says. Never. If you feel like it, search for J.J.Benitez. He wrote some interesting books about Jesus. He totally made me chnge my mind about religion. Now Im sure Jesus existed and Im sure Church manipulated history. If I need to trust in a book I rather choose "Caballo de Troya" by Benitez than the bible.

[basicamenteyo]

:thumb_yello:The word "Adam" is a Hebrew source. It's still in our lexicon, when we wanna say "man" for example, and also people are called "Adam". Or when we wanna say "a human being" we say "Ben - Adam" ("Ben"= child, boy, offspring)

btw, Eve in Hebrew is called "Hava"

 

Exactly. not a name of a man.

[lollipop161]

Exactly. not a name of a man.

 

And if you want to delve into the word "Adam" - it comes from "Adama"- which means "ground\soil" by the belief that god created man from earth soil..

also, "Dam" means blood. Hebrew is a difficult language:aah:

[basicamenteyo]

And if you want to delve into the word "Adam" - it comes from "Adama"- which means "ground\soil" by the belief that god created man from earth soil..

also, "Dam" means blood. Hebrew is a difficult language:aah:

 

It is!!! But very interesting too!!! Thanks!

[suzie]

trust in what Church says. Never. If you feel like it, search for J.J.Benitez. He wrote some interesting books about Jesus. He totally made me chnge my mind about religion. Now Im sure Jesus existed and Im sure Church manipulated history. If I need to trust in a book I rather choose "Caballo de Troya" by Benitez than the bible.

 

Yes, that's why I thought it was interesting to highlight the difference between religion and church. The church is merely interpreting what they believe is the universal truth and also manipulating it to a large extent. One can be religious but, at the same time, not accept all the doctrines of the church, whichever denomination we are talking about.

Edited July 15, 2012 by suzie

[krjsantos]

LOL he does. I dont trust in what Church says. Never. If you feel like it, search for J.J.Benitez. He wrote some interesting books about Jesus. He totally made me chnge my mind about religion. Now Im sure Jesus existed and Im sure Church manipulated history. If I need to trust in a book I rather choose "Caballo de Troya" by Benitez than the bible.

 

Me too! I read this book, really good

[basicamenteyo]

Me too! I read this book, really good

 

REALLY??? There are seven more books based on different parts of Jesus life. All of them equal interesting.

[Marilyn Mastin]

LOL he does. I dont trust in what Church says. Never. If you feel like it, search for J.J.Benitez. He wrote some interesting books about Jesus. He totally made me chnge my mind about religion. Now Im sure Jesus existed and Im sure Church manipulated history. If I need to trust in a book I rather choose "Caballo de Troya" by Benitez than the bible.

Christianity as it is now, is nothing like the original church. The Emperor Constantine is always touted as the first Christian Emperor. He was really the start of the church being centred in Rome, but he actually screwed it up.

He actually worshiped the sun, hence he chaged the sabbath day from Saturday, to Sunday, and linked Easter with the worship of some goddess. Christmas, the 25th December, is actually the sun god's birthday. Jesus was born in Springtime actually. But Constantine mixed up his paegan beliefs and created his own form of Christianity.

Easter is wrong anyway, as between Good Friday Evening, when Our Lord was laid in the tomb, to dawn on Sunday, is not three days.

Some good publications I have read about how the faith got currupted by man, are Counterfeit Christianity, and Jesus Christ: The Real Story, both available from

http://www.magazine.org The United Church of God.

Thank you for your recomendation of those books

[basicamenteyo]

Christianity as it is now, is nothing like the original church. The Emperor Constantine is always touted as the first Christian Emperor. He was really the start of the church being centred in Rome, but he actually screwed it up.

He actually worshiped the sun, hence he chaged the sabbath day from Saturday, to Sunday, and linked Easter with the worship of some goddess. Christmas, the 25th December, is actually the sun god's birthday. Jesus was born in Springtime actually. But Constantine mixed up his paegan beliefs and created his own form of Christianity.

Easter is wrong anyway, as between Good Friday Evening, when Our Lord was laid in the tomb, to dawn on Sunday, is not three days.

Some good publications I have read about how the faith got currupted by man, are Counterfeit Christianity, and Jesus Christ: The Real Story, both available from

http://www.magazine.org The United Church of God.

Thank you for your recomendation of those books

 

Im from phone now but will check the link later. Yes I know everything about those fake celebrations we have now. Ive read a lot about Jesus and thats why I hate Church. Its all about money now. What about letting people eat meat during Easter if they pay what we call "bula"? It means that its ok to do it as long as they get money... F*CK YOU DEAR CHURCH

 

 

I think I should stop talking about this before God bans me

[Marilyn Mastin]

Im from phone now but will check the link later. Yes I know everything about those fake celebrations we have now. Ive read a lot about Jesus and thats why I hate Church. Its all about money now. What about letting people eat meat during Easter if they pay what we call "bula"? It means that its ok to do it as long as they get money... F*CK YOU DEAR CHURCH

 

 

I think I should stop talking about this before God bans me

I agree. But the discussion has been good though.