MIKA in Rome for ZOOLANDER 2

[IngievV]

For as long as I can remember on this forum, there has been conflict between the fans who see Mika as perfect and do not want to hear anything negative about him VS the fans who understand that Mika is NOT perfect and feel free to criticize him. Each group seems to think the other is "wrong" in their opinions. Members of each group want to sway the members of the other group to their way of thinking and behaving.

 

It's not uncommon for one group to say, "You're bullying us!" to the other group. The "Mika is perfect" group wants the "Mika is NOT perfect" group to shut up, because they feel it is disrespectful, or because they feel there's a superior attitude. The "Mika is NOT perfect" group wants the "Mika is perfect" group to be realistic and stop acting like everything Mika says and does is interesting or worthy, or a "masterpiece."

 

Each group does a fair amount of intimidating the other group, basically trying to bully them into submission. Harsh words are exchanged, or equally bad, people are silenced or driven from the forum because they don't want to, or don't know how to, deal with confrontation. We've lost A LOT of members that way.

 

And that's a shame..

 

The truth is that there is room for both groups on MFC, and the differences are what make us interesting! It would be so boring if all we said all day in every thread was, "Mika is beautiful, Mika is a genius, Mika is perfect in every way..." It would be just as bad if the constant commentary was, "Mika is so stupid, Mika is a no-talent, has-been, one-hit-wonder." It's reading both perspectives that keeps things interesting here, for me at least.

 

 

No need to crawl back under a rock. You're exactly right, and this is what I'm trying to say, too.

 

I think the way this conversation has evolved is great -- I hope Yang and Ingie really mean it when they say they have worked it all out. It's very valid for anyone to say, "look, you hurt my feelings when you said that." Any of us can relate to that and respect that. And I think that's way better than letting your bad feelings simmer inside until they bubble over and cause you to say nasty things in the heat of the moment, or worse, cause you to talk about a person behind their back and spread negativity about them.

 

Finally, I just want to say that I've met so many people here on the forum in real life, and with the very rare exception, they have all been lovely -- regardless of how they may have come across in their posts. I'm not saying that the MFC can ever be one big, happy, perfect family... even our own real families aren't like that! But I think in general we can all get along most of the time, and that's what keeps me coming back here day after day, year after year.

 

 

Yes, it is all fine now. At least it is for me. Although I can't take credit for being in the subtitles team cause I am not XD

 

I guess I don't come on MFC as much any more because I've felt like I couldn't say anything without being labelled as a b*tch or a bully. I prefer to think that I am passionate, more than hostile. But for years MFC had been my home, but I don't really feel like I belong here anymore. Maybe my personality isn't fit for this MFC and I know that people say bad things about me behind my back. If that makes them feel better about themselves, then fine. I just come back now and then to remember the times when I did feel like I belonged here. When I felt like I could take part in a conversation without constantly having to defend myself.

 

But that's ok. You live and you learn and I cherish the good things and friendships that I've found on MFC.

[Pascale]

I find it interesting but also a bit disappointing that discussions on this forum often end up in a discussion about two groups (the "Mika is perfect" group and the "I don't like some things Mika does but I'm not allowed to say that" group).  

 

I don’t feel that I belong of any of those two sides and I have the feeling there a lot more fans like me. But somehow when you take part in a discussion you’re likely to end up in any of those groups. I therefore usually choose the “save way” (quoting Elwendin). Not just because I ám a bit scared to get into fiery confrontations but also because I hope to avoid the group forming process and to have a more constructive discussion. Admittedly, this is certainly way less funny and straightforward. Sorry, it’s a catch 22 and I’m a bit of a lengthy “there’s something to say for both opinions” writer anyway.

 

So back to the topic if anyone is still interested: Ben Stiller and his remarks.

Firstly I don't think Mika is perfect at all (love him for not being that) and I don’t care about what Ben Stiller thinks of Mika. But I like watching interviews and guessing what is going on behind the “actual talking”. And this interview is great to do so because of the mixed body language and ambiguous use of words.

 

I got the feeling that Ben’s remarks were not just nice but a bit mocking as well. He said positive things but (as Yang said) they didn’t sound entirely sincere but as if he was making fun of Mika as well. For example: His music is very inspiring to me in the Zoolander world” . His eyes were laughing a lot during this remark. This is very subjective of course but apparently there are more people having this feeling.   

 

Also I’m not so sure whether having the Zoolander DNA is a very positive thing in the eyes of Ben Stiller. Isn’t Zoolander a character that is a more than willing part of a very superficial one-dimensional world? A parody and a caricature. Words as “good looking” and “talented”  suddenly sound very suspicious in that context.

 

Maybe this impression is not correct and Ben Stiller meant everything he said in a unambiguously nice and positive way. Probably it is a bit of both (yeah…save and boring) and he really likes Mika but he sees his vanity and his attraction to the Italian tv and fashion world and he humors it.

 

I don’t find that disrespectful in itself. No idea though how the two of them get along in real live and how Mika feels about the cutting or would feel about the interview (he most likely will never see it anyway). Since he has a good sense of humor and he’s used to all kinds of comments I guess he wouldn’t mind that much.   

 

 

[crazyaboutmika]

 How did we end up like this

Under a burning sky?

Some things are better unsaid. 

It's easier to lie. 

 

I'm burning, but my heart is on the wire. 

Don't need a thousand guards to lock me in. 

Doesn't take a fool to start a fire. 

Solitary spark and wars begin. 

 

You say it's only words

And that it will get easier with time. 

Nothing's only words 

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

I can't, I can't 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

I can't stop hearing all the words you said 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

I can't stop hearing words. 

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

How did it all come to this? 

We started off as friends. 

It makes it easy to leave

If we're strangers by the end. 

 

I'm burning, but my heart is on the wire. 

Don't need a thousand guards to lock me in. 

Doesn't take a fool to start a fire. 

Solitary spark and wars begin. 

 

You say it's only words

And that it will get easier with time. 

Nothing's only words 

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

I can't, I can't 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

I can't stop hearing all the words you said 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

I can't stop hearing words. 

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

You say it's only words

And that it will get easier with time 

Nothing's only words 

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

You say it's only words 

It doesn't matter if they're also mine. 

Nothing's only words

That's how hearts get hurt. 

 

I can't, I can't 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

I can't stop hearing all the words you said 

I can't stop hearing all the words you said

Let's stop using words.

That's how hearts get hurt.

 

Relax, everyone We're just a (big) normal family

Edited February 28, 2016 by crazyaboutmika

[Pascale]

Yes, it is all fine now. At least it is for me. Although I can't take credit for being in the subtitles team cause I am not XD

 

I guess I don't come on MFC as much any more because I've felt like I couldn't say anything without being labelled as a b*tch or a bully. I prefer to think that I am passionate, more than hostile. But for years MFC had been my home, but I don't really feel like I belong here anymore. Maybe my personality isn't fit for this MFC and I know that people say bad things about me behind my back. If that makes them feel better about themselves, then fine. I just come back now and then to remember the times when I did feel like I belonged here. When I felt like I could take part in a conversation without constantly having to defend myself.

 

But that's ok. You live and you learn and I cherish the good things and friendships that I've found on MFC.

I like your "passionate" and straight comments, Ingrid, although it's not my style. And I love the way you and Yang got out of the groups. No defending necessary there..

Edited February 29, 2016 by Pascale

[crazyaboutmika]

Yes, it is all fine now. At least it is for me. Although I can't take credit for being in the subtitles team cause I am not XD

 

I guess I don't come on MFC as much any more because I've felt like I couldn't say anything without being labelled as a b*tch or a bully. I prefer to think that I am passionate, more than hostile. But for years MFC had been my home, but I don't really feel like I belong here anymore. Maybe my personality isn't fit for this MFC and I know that people say bad things about me behind my back. If that makes them feel better about themselves, then fine. I just come back now and then to remember the times when I did feel like I belonged here. When I felt like I could take part in a conversation without constantly having to defend myself.

 

But that's ok. You live and you learn and I cherish the good things and friendships that I've found on MFC.

Please, post more often Ingie, I loooooove your siggie

Edited February 28, 2016 by crazyaboutmika

[yang]

Yes, it is all fine now. At least it is for me. Although I can't take credit for being in the subtitles team cause I am not XD

 

I guess I don't come on MFC as much any more because I've felt like I couldn't say anything without being labelled as a b*tch or a bully. I prefer to think that I am passionate, more than hostile. But for years MFC had been my home, but I don't really feel like I belong here anymore. Maybe my personality isn't fit for this MFC and I know that people say bad things about me behind my back. If that makes them feel better about themselves, then fine. I just come back now and then to remember the times when I did feel like I belonged here. When I felt like I could take part in a conversation without constantly having to defend myself.

 

But that's ok. You live and you learn and I cherish the good things and friendships that I've found on MFC.

It's fine for me too~ Oh Ingie you are not part of the subtitles team? I must mistake you to someone else  , sorry I'm really not  good at remember names ! That's why I opened a thread just about id and names!

 

Sorry to be one of the people gossiping behind you backs, just let you know, there are several reasons we gossip instead of saying in front of people. First, honestly speaking, in many culture, and in many people's believing, talking in the back in not good for sure, but it's not as impolite as to tell people that. I know it's really hurtful when you know someone is talking behind your back, but to be honest when I feel hurt, my first response is to complain the people who hurt me to others instead of just tell that people I got hurt. And I know sometimes you know the gossip anyway,  but in many times ( maybe not always, but most times) the intention is to never let you know about we are complaining... Second, besides that some of us think it's impolite, we also dont like confrontation ( really dont like, it took a lot courage of me to posts the first respond quote when I was shocked). I know you feel that is ridiculous to call you bully, since you have no intention to attack people, but when you are strict in the posts(at least with the wording), someone like it, someone find it funny, someone feel scared and that they are being intimated. I really appologize to call you bully, and I should never do that, since you are actually not a bad person and you have no intention to scare me or being sarcasm. I just want you know, we are not bad people either.

 

Again, no matter what reasons, it's never good to gossip behind people's back. I'm really really sorry I have done that. I will stop doing that on MFC. Unless it's like, we are really jealous of dcdeb ( ), or Hon is awesome translating the voice ( ), at least I will try my best to avoid saying negative things of other people behind the back. And if I feel hurt, shocking, confusing, or scary, I will just say it out, and try to let the other MFCer explain the real meaning behind the sentences/posts.

Edited February 29, 2016 by yang

[Christine]

Also I’m not so sure whether having the Zoolander DNA is a very positive thing in the eyes of Ben Stiller. Isn’t Zoolander a character that is a more than willing part of a very superficial one-dimensional world? A parody and a caricature. Words as “good looking” and “talented”  suddenly sound very suspicious in that context.

But this is exactly what Mika is projecting to the world now, especially in this context of getting a job in a movie because of his relationship with Valentino and no other reason, since I highly doubt Ben Stiller & co would have sought Mika out themselves.

 

I have no interest in convincing anyone that Mika is not perfect. I just find it ridiculous when someone is demonized for not worshiping the ground he walks on. If Mika comes across as a bit of a Derek Zoolander to people who barely know anything about him, I really don't think it's Ben Stiller's fault. To me the comparisons are obvious, especially since Mika looks like Ben Stiller and fans even have names for Mika's own Blue Steel (Da Stare, the Apple Pose).

 

Even if you want to take Stiller's comments as mockery, it is so mild compared to the kinds of things Mika's detractors said about him in 2007 it is not even worth noting IMO. After all, Ben Stiller created this character as a likeable sort of hero, so it's not like he hates him or thinks he's repulsive, etc.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Christine

[yang]

But this is exactly what Mika is projecting to the world now, especially in this context of getting a job in a movie because of his relationship with Valentino and no other reason, since I highly doubt Ben Stiller & co would have sought Mika out themselves.

 

I have no interest in convincing anyone that Mika is not perfect. I just find it ridiculous when someone is demonized for not worshiping the ground he walks on. If Mika comes across as a bit of a Derek Zoolander to people who barely know anything about him, I really don't think it's Ben Stiller's fault. To me the comparisons are obvious, especially since Mika looks like Ben Stiller and fans even have names for Mika's own Blue Steel (Da Stare, the Apple Pose).

 

Even if you want to take Stiller's comments as mockery, it is so mild compared to the kinds of things Mika's detractors said about him in 2007 it is not even worth noting IMO. After all, Ben Stiller created this character as a likeable sort of hero, so it's not like he hates him or thinks he's repulsive, etc.

 

I don't think Stiller's comments are that bad, like saying nasty things or something. But please do know that, a brush-off recommendation is actually worse than no recommendation, this is almost like rule number one when we students asking for recommendation letter from Professors. Maybe this is not exactly the right analogy here，but I hope my point is understandable. Because the way I feel it, is that he just brush off the question, and that's annoying to me. I just wish Ben Stiller could be more sincere, even maybe that's too much to ask as Ingie pointed out, it's just as a fan I wish that.

Edited February 29, 2016 by yang

[Christine]

I don't think Stiller's comments are that bad, like saying nasty things or something. But please do know that, a brush-off recommendation is actually worse than no recommendation, this is almost like rule number one when we students asking for recommendation letter from Professors. Maybe this is not exactly the right analogy here. Because the way I feel it, is that he just brush off the question, and that's annoying to me. I just wish Ben Stiller could be more sincere, even maybe that's too much to ask as Ingie pointed out, it's just as a fan I wish that.

I think it is too much to ask. Honestly I am amazed that Ben Stiller knows or remembers anything about Mika. That's why I thought his reaction was cute and perceptive. Ask anyone else in Hollywood what they think of Mika and chances are you will just get a blank stare (kind of like Owen Wilson's).

[yang]

I think it is too much to ask. Honestly I am amazed that Ben Stiller knows or remembers anything about Mika. That's why I thought his reaction was cute and perceptive. Ask anyone else in Hollywood what they think of Mika and chances are you will just get a blank stare (kind of like Owen Wilson's).

Well as you said he created a character based on mika (maybe i understand wrong), but I think Mika is not the one pushing to get the position, he is INVITED, right? So Ben Stiller should remember Mika, and I know Mika is not famous in US, but if he is invited to the movie, and Ben Stiller is the director and producer, maybe he should be more sincere.

[IngievV]

Well as you said he created a character based on mika (maybe i understand wrong), but I think Mika is not the one pushing to get the position, he is INVITED, right? So Ben Stiller should remember Mika, and I know Mika is not famous in US, but if he is invited to the movie, and Ben Stiller is the director and producer, maybe he should be more sincere.

 

He did not create a character based on Mika. The first Zoolander film came out in 2001. And I doubt Ben Stiller is the one who invited Mika. And he did remember Mika. Ben Stiller is a comedy actor but that doesn't mean he is always super excited and out there. Look at this interview:

 

I still believe you are reading too much into this whole thing. I am sure Ben Stiller did not intent to be 'rude'.

[Christine]

Well as you said he created a character based on mika (maybe i understand wrong), but I think Mika is not the one pushing to get the position, he is INVITED, right? So Ben Stiller should remember Mika, and I know Mika is not famous in US, but if he is invited to the movie, and Ben Stiller is the director and producer, maybe he should be more sincere.

No, the character was created when Mika was a teenager. I just meant that obviously Ben Stiller has a fondness for his own character, so I think it is inherently a kind of compliment for him to compare Mika to Zoolander.

 

I don't know what exactly happened with Mika getting a part in the movie, but I would think it had everything to do with Valentino and was not Ben Stiller's idea. If I understood correctly they used a Valentino fashion show for a scene in the movie. I think it was Owen Wilson who was walking down the runway in one of the suits I've seen Mika wear.

[IngievV]

It's fine for me too~ Oh Ingie you are not part of the subtitles team? I must mistake you to someone else  , sorry I'm really not  good at remember names ! That's why I opened a thread just about id and names!

 

Sorry to be one of the people gossiping behind you backs, just let you know, there are several reasons we gossip instead of saying in front of people. First, honestly speaking, in many culture, and in many people's believing, talking in the back in not good for sure, but it's not as impolite as to tell people that. I know it's really hurtful when you know someone is talking behind your back, but to be honest when I feel hurt, my first response is to complain the people who hurt me to others instead of just tell that people I got hurt. And I know sometimes you know the gossip anyway,  but in many times ( maybe not always, but most times) the intention is to never let you know about we are complaining... Second, besides that some of us think it's impolite, we also dont like confrontation ( really dont like, it took a lot courage of me to posts the first respond quote when I was shocked). I know you feel that is ridiculous to call you bully, since you have no intention to attack people, but when you are strict in the posts(at least with the wording), someone like it, someone find it funny, someone feel scared and that they are being intimated. I really appologize to call you bully, and I should never do that, since you are actually not a bad person and you have no intention to scare me or being sarcasm. I just want you know, we are not bad people either.

 

Again, no matter what reasons, it's never good to gossip behind people's back. I'm really really sorry I have done that. I will stop doing that on MFC. Unless it's like, we are really jealous of dcdeb ( ), or Hon is awesome translating the voice ( ), at least I will try my best to avoid saying negative things of other people behind the back. And if I feel hurt, shocking, confusing, or scary, I will just say it out, and try to let the other MFCer explain the real meaning behind the sentences/posts.

 

The thing is, being talked about behind your back is infinitely more hurtful, especially when you consider somebody a friend and that has happened to me before. Do I never say anything bad about somebody behind their backs? Of course not. But I also have no issue telling a person to their face what my problem with them is. Thing is, you can say things behind somebody's back and feel good about yourself that you avoided yet another confrontation. But the thing is, when you do that you only create more anger and more dislike towards the person you are talking about because you say one thing, someone else agrees and says something worse and it builts up like that. And how can you expect somebody to change or be aware of their behaviour if you never let them know?

 

And not everybody has to like me. By all means, if you feel like you need to hold a grudge against me for whatever horrible thing I have done to you, be my guest (generally speaking). If that makes you feel better, then I will happily be the one to burn. Just don't accuse me of being a bully when I find out and fire back because I am not really afraid of confrontation.

[Christine]

I still believe you are reading too much into this whole thing. I am sure Ben Stiller did not intent to be 'rude'.

Yes I watched it again and I am not seeing it. If I understand the French correctly (?), someone asked if he found Mika shy or eccentric and Ben Stiller said "no, I love Mika, he's an incredible artist". What could he possibly have said that is more positive than that?

[Marilyn Mastin]

What has happened, or been said, may be disappointing, but it is understandable. If Mika wants to be famous in the US, he has to do something more than a cameo in a movie. That is not going to get him any US fans, or raise his profile there.

So if he thought that being in Zoolander 2 was going to help his career, he has had another think coming (as we say in England) because it hasn't worked.

Mika definitely isn't perfect. Mika is infuriating.

He shouldn't bother with the movies, unless it's a much better, or bigger, part, but what I would say to him, if I could speak to him about it, is that he should stick to trying to get his music into the top movies. He's a musician, and it only takes one song to become popular in a big-budget movie, and Mika could have US, and world, success.

He should also have a proper tour in the USA. Not just small gigs here and there. He treats the USA the same way he treats the UK, and that's why he has no career in either country.

It's not important what Ben Stiller, or other actors think. It's their own opinions. Not worth getting upset about. The fact is, he doesn't know anything about Mika as Mika hasn't tried hard enough to get a career in the USA. He's too busy with getting a career in Italy and France. 

[Pascale]

He did not create a character based on Mika. The first Zoolander film came out in 2001. And I doubt Ben Stiller is the one who invited Mika. And he did remember Mika. Ben Stiller is a comedy actor but that doesn't mean he is always super excited and out there. Look at this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVq8Pw_D-88

 

I still believe you are reading too much into this whole thing. I am sure Ben Stiller did not intent to be 'rude'.

 

Thanks for posting the interview. It shows that Ben Stiller has a almost permanent ironic expression on his face when he talks about Zoolander and the selfie culture. So, maybe too much reading into his ironic remarks about Mika. Although I can't help thinking that his words about Derek Zoolander "He's a sweet guy, he's a sweet innocent guy who really is incredibly self absorbed but he's not really aware of it." combine perfectly with his earlier remarks about Mika.

Yes I watched it again and I am not seeing it. If I understand the French correctly (?), someone asked if he found Mika shy or eccentric and Ben Stiller said "no, I love Mika, he's an incredible artist". What could he possibly have said that is more positive than that?

It's not about the words, it's about the way he says them. I think his first sentence was genuinely meant positive but going on, he seemed more and more amused by the resemblance between Zoolander and Mika and his remarks were kind of ironic and ambiguous. That's not a bad or rude thing. As you say he seems very fond of this character he created and he recognizes that we,being human, all have a Zoolander in ourselves.

But to me it still is (mild) mockery and not mere praising and positive commentary. Not that there' s anything wrong with that. I love friendly teasing and irony as long as it isn't mean and doesn't become too easy and cynical.

 

By the way, I don't think Mika is like Zoolander. He's much more complicated and less naive. But there's a sweet innocent self absorbed little Zoolander in him like in most of us. And I prefer to think that he ís aware of that but he is not afraid to show it.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Pascale

[krysady]

After reading so many negative critics and reviews in the media about this movie,probably it's not such a disaster that his cameo have been cut out after all 

Edited February 29, 2016 by krysady

[IngievV]

After reading so many negative critics and reviews in the media about this movie,probably it's not such a disaster that his cameo have been cut out after all 

 

I actually quite liked it.

[mamiam]

I don't like that MFCers should be divided into  two groups - those who see MIKA as perfect, and those who don't !    We're all grown-up people, who know that no human being is perfect!   It might be just a way of saying things, a way of expressing that we think MIKA is over average, is more than "an ordinary man"    Everybody has an own opinion of him, and all his doings, and choices. We all have to respect that - both ways of course - and be nice to each other!   

We're all coming here on MFC, using some of our time - because we all love MIKA - and we should be able to discuss things, in a nuancing and respectful way...

 

About the film Zoolander 2, I still haven't watched it...

 

Love, love

me

[krysady]

 If Mika wants to be famous in the US, he has to do something more than a cameo in a movie. 

 

 He treats the USA the same way he treats the UK, and that's why he has no career in either country.

 

 Mika hasn't tried hard enough to get a career in the USA. He's too busy with getting a career in Italy and France. 

 

I know you want the best for him,but what if he doesn't want all that? What if he is perfectly happy the way he is right now? In fact he said it many times in interviews lately that he's happy with his life,and he's having fun,so maybe this is enough for him..... and maybe for many of us 

[krysady]

I actually quite liked it.

 

I read that it's not at the same level as the first Zoolander,but I didn't see it yet to make an opinion. Anyway,I like Ben Stiller,so I'm planning to watch it soon.

[Christine]

By the way, I don't think Mika is like Zoolander. He's much more complicated and less naive. But there's a sweet innocent self absorbed little Zoolander in him like in most of us. And I prefer to think that he ís aware of that but he is not afraid to show it.

Well yes, no human being is really Zoolander. As you said earlier he is a total caricature. But IMO Mika is in denial about how vacuous his interest in designer clothes and shoes and the whole world around them comes across. He makes nonsensical claims that he is not interested in fashion and tries to portray the people who make his clothes as brilliant artists (as opposed to other designers, even other designers at Valentino, who we all know are directly responsible for the exploitative and shallow world portrayed in Zoolander). This is another area, like starring in reality TV, that Mika doesn't completely own up to, since he tries to convince himself and others that it is as noble an artistic pursuit as his music.

 

I follow a gay political writer on Twitter who is obsessed with his image. He tweeted a pic of himself the other day and said "I just checked my privilege and it's fabulous". This embracing and exaggeration of one's own vanity is how you make yourself impervious to mocking by others. Not trying to disguise vanity as some sort of artistic endeavour.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Christine

[yang]

The thing is, being talked about behind your back is infinitely more hurtful, especially when you consider somebody a friend and that has happened to me before.

 

That is very hurtful for sure, especially when the words come from someone you consider as a friend.

I had somebody I considered friend in middle school, to whom I shared all the stuff I liked a lot (a really sweet and crispy apple, a piece of fruit cake, a wristlet knitted by me), and one day she just followed the popular girls' lead and called me slut in front of me (and I was only ten years old and not even a teenager). Honestly, I prefer her to say that behind my back and never let me know. 

 

 But the thing is, when you do that you only create more anger and more dislike towards the person you are talking about because you say one thing, someone else agrees and says something worse and it builts up like that. And how can you expect somebody to change or be aware of their behaviour if you never let them know?

 

 

That's true.

 

 

And not everybody has to like me. By all means, if you feel like you need to hold a grudge against me for whatever horrible thing I have done to you, be my guest (generally speaking). If that makes you feel better, then I will happily be the one to burn. Just don't accuse me of being a bully when I find out and fire back because I am not really afraid of confrontation.

 

First of all, apparently "bully" is a worse word than I thought, so I will never use it again in MFC.

But please understand, not everyone is not afraid of confrontation, especially confront someone you thought she/he is very sassy(not in a good way), because confrontation may cause more unhappy word ( in my case, I got the word ' so dramatic', which I know now you have no intention to hurt me, but not back then).

 

And, don't be the one to burn! It breaks my heart to hear that!

Edited February 29, 2016 by yang

[Pascale]

Well yes, no human being is really Zoolander. As you said earlier he is a total caricature. But IMO Mika is in denial about how vacuous his interest in designer clothes and shoes and the whole world around them comes across. He makes nonsensical claims that he is not interested in fashion and tries to portray the people who make his clothes as brilliant artists (as opposed to other designers, even other designers at Valentino, who we all know are directly responsible for the exploitative and shallow world portrayed in Zoolander). This is another area, like starring in reality TV, that Mika doesn't completely own up to, since he tries to convince himself and others that it is as noble an artistic pursuit as his music.

 

I follow a gay political writer on Twitter who is obsessed with his image. He tweeted a pic of himself the other day and said "I just checked my privilege and it's fabulous". This embracing and exaggeration of one's own vanity is how you make yourself impervious to mocking by others. Not trying to disguise vanity as some sort of artistic endeavour.

I can't understand myself why Mika is making this big difference between the two Valentino designers of his clothes and other designers. I'm not very impressed by their designs of his suits. They don't seem very original of innovating to me, mostly just using different prints at the same kind of suits that most men are wearing. I would expect more daring use of fabric or forms from such artistic wonderboys. But since I am not a dedicated follower of fashion, I'm not so involved in this subject. The clothes are colorful, he loves them and he thinks they are very artistic and special. Well, maybe they are, I’ll give it the benefit of the doubt.

 

But it's not only about the clothes. According to his public comments, Mika thinks most things he does and people he works with are awesome. He often talks extremely positive about them. He seems very happy with his songs, he talks proudly about most clips and directors. He's writing a book that according to his own words is going to be very special. His stage designers are brilliant, Peter Lindbergh is an exceptional photographer, X-factor is a different and far more creative talent show than all the others  (except the Voice France  ) . etc.etc. Even Paul de Leeuw is not only a friend but a genius. In general he seems very convinced about his taste and about the things he loves like certain songs or books of other artists. Words as brilliant of amazing are frequently used. 

 

I admire this (apparent) great belief in himself and in the things he loves. You may call it pretentious, vain or self-absorbed (I know I've used those words myself    ) but you may just as well call it self-assured or strong. A matter of opinion. You could say that he nowadays is lost in an empty and vain world of fashion, social media and tv and drifted away from true artistry. You could also say that his curiosity and firm beliefs motivate him to explore all kinds of new and exiting things (tv work/ symphonic orchestra project/ writing a book/ new ideas or designs for his show).

 

We can argue about the artistic level of his recent products and projects. That has been done more than once (as well as about his former ones). He doesn't seem to care a lot about that or how things come across. Is that denial?  You might as well say it shows character. Yes, people can and do ridicule him and criticize him. Perhaps he even may look back one day and will think differently then about some of the things he is doing and loving now. Does that mean that he is deceiving himself (or others) now? I think I understand your feelings (and share them sometimes) but I’m not so sure as you seem to be about the answer to that question.

 

And no, he is not impervious to mocking but neither is the gay politician, I think.  Awareness, irony or self-mockery/criticism don’t make you invulnerable. They probably make you more self-conscious and careful and that is not necessarily a  good thing for an artist.

Edited March 1, 2016 by Pascale

[mamiam]

Thank you Pascale - for your reflected and interesting thoughts here -

 

Love, love

me