Marilyn Mastin Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I had to because i went to a private hospital before i had the stroke, just to find out what i had, because all my doctors work there...then, after the coma they wouldn't like to move me to a public one so i had to stay the whole time in the private one... Which was good, in a way, or by the time we're speaking here, i woudn't be alive anymore as in a public health institution/hospital they wouldn't lose so much time recovering me back to life as they did in the private hospital... In here, if you don't regain self consciouness in half an hour they won't try heart recovery any longer and you die... On the private hospital they tried to keep me back to life for an hour and a half... It's disgusting when you don't get the same care in a public hospital! Thank goodness you were in a place where they looked after you! But it's awful for people who are not so lucky. It shouldn't matter what hospital a person is in, or how much money they have to spend on treatment. The care ought to be the same everywhere! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willywonka Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 It's disgusting when you don't get the same care in a public hospital! Thank goodness you were in a place where they looked after you! But it's awful for people who are not so lucky.It shouldn't matter what hospital a person is in, or how much money they have to spend on treatment. The care ought to be the same everywhere! Exactly, Marylin! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etoile2roses Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Thanks Nezza for the translation I hope Paloma will have a quick recovery and will be able to walk very soon @Wonka I am thinking of Axie a lot this time, a lot of love for her, her family and her friends Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willywonka Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Thanks Nezza for the translation I hope Paloma will have a quick recovery and will be able to walk very soon @Wonka I am thinking of Axie a lot this time, a lot of love for her, her family and her friends Me too, I think about her everytime i log in, hoping for some good news at her thread... Hope she wakes up very soon.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siu Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 It's disgusting when you don't get the same care in a public hospital! Thank goodness you were in a place where they looked after you! But it's awful for people who are not so lucky.It shouldn't matter what hospital a person is in, or how much money they have to spend on treatment. The care ought to be the same everywhere! Exactly! That's what we call 'getting a bigger smile for your money' in private clinics. Many of the doctors in the town I used to live work both in the state hospital and in one or two private clinics. I've been to a private clinic only once, when I had no time to wait for months for the appointment. The very same doctor, who usually didn't raise his eyes from the papers during the whole visit in the hospital clinic, looked at me and smiled to me the whole quarter of an hour in the private clinic. I don't need my doctor to smile to me, but what bothers me is what the difference stands for - pay and you get treated humanely, otherwise you're just another object on the hospital conveyor belt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toy_girl_mika96 Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 The US's healthcare is ridiculous, it's over $1,000 for one night in a hospital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lollipop_monkey Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 thanks...i may stop and have a coffee too be back soonish How very Italian of you! I wanted to get a summary out there for everyone to understand as quickly as I could. Thank you Nerys! Much appreciated, as always! What I didn't know is that Paloma had been conscious all the time. That's terrible. That's what I was thinking too. I had been hoping that she had either lost consciousness naturally or that the paramedics had given her something. Wow. I just can't imagine. I was in a coma for 20 days after a stroke and trust me, it's not good to wake up and find out u have a bill of almost 50,000 euros to pay... What a nightmare! Being Canadian I hear these horror stories coming out of the US all the time, but I'm rather far removed from how it works in different European countries. That's just brutal. That said I'm so glad you got the care you needed, and that you're still here with us. So our state-financed health care is not for free, either. I would not even have my arm plastered without giving the doctor some money or at least offering it, as you simply can't expect to be looked after without 'bribing' them. I can't even imagine bringing money to a doctor's office. We're really lucky in Canada. That is really shocking Wonka. I'm sorry they had to add financial insult to injury. It's just awful to think it could completely wipe out a family when they are already struggling with health issues. Outrageous. We don't have a two tiered system in my province in Canada. The government pays for primary health care no matter who your doctor is or what hospital you go to. I've never seen a bill from a doctor or hospital in my life. I can't even imagine. I'm just glad you're still here. Same thing in my province. Pretty much the only things you pay for are prescription medications (outside of a hospital; your meds while you're an in-patient are covered), dental care, ambulance rides and vision testing. Anything else, from a broken arm to a fall in the street to a stroke are all covered by the government. Like Christine said, you never even see a bill. They just make a note of your provincial healthcare number and it's all taken care of. the guy asked me if I had any private health plan. I said "yes" and asked him to get the card in my wallet. He took it and said "oh, I'm sorry, but we don't know about any hospital that accepts your plan, we're gonna take you to a public one" and I was like "noooooo :shocked:". Wow. I can't imagine what it's like to have a parallel public/private system with medical personnel making decisions in the street as to where to take patients. Unbelievable. The US's healthcare is ridiculous, it's over $1,000 for one night in a hospital. A friend of mine in California gave birth to a baby who was born with a hole in his diaphragm; what that meant is that most of his organs that were supposed to be in his abdomen migrated through this hole and into his chest cavity. Between the extra care my friend needed plus all the surgeries the baby needed, their total hospital tab was well over $300,000. Thank god she and her husband have great insurance that covered nearly all of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAK1 Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Me too, I think about her everytime i log in, hoping for some good news at her thread... Hope she wakes up very soon.... I was shocked to hear about Axie! I didn't realise her condition had changed, my thoughts are with her and her family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosie-Posie Boffin Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 First of all thanks for the summaries even though I couldn't read them...I couldn't read them both because I need to stay focused as I have some serious exams waiting for me ( I know I am not going to be able consantrate on anything but her) and because I wanted to read the article which is so personal...by his own words... I know how devastating is to watch your most beloved ones to fight for their lifes and how hard to talk about it as my mother got through canser 4 years ago..Mentioning what happened makes you live that nightmare all over again... and Wonka...I can only imagine how hard it could be for both you and your family...and I don't even want to think what could have happened to my mother if the life insurace haven't payed the bills (even though it dosen't cover the payment's %100) because both the cemo and the medicine is overly expensive for a disease like this which can actually cost your life..It drives me mad how people can put a price on a humans life... I am incredibly happy that you're still with us and I wish you'll never have to face with a situation like that again..and I truly mean it with all my heart... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kath Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Thanks Robi! Here's my summary The article's about Paloma. He starts by saying what happened to her, and that certain things in life happen that make you realise that in life people shouldn't be alone. He says that Paloma's accident happened after her housewarming party, and that she's disabled, in the sense that the left side of her body's much weaker then the right side. He went home around midnight, but around 5am he was woken up by people knocking at his door - Paloma had fallen out of her bedroom window on the 4th floor onto the railings below. When he arrived at her house the firemen and paramedics were trying to get her free. He hid with his brother in an ambulance and phoned his relatives all over the world, telling them to come over. It was his dad's 60th birthday, and he was away in Dubai, hearing Mika on the phone he thought that he'd come to Dubai to surprise him. It took 2 hours to free Paloma, and she was conscious for the whole time. He says that the whole neighbourhood was awake, watching silently as she was freed. Paloma was taken by helicopter to the Royal London Hospital, where her life was saved thanks to a 14 hour operation. Incredibly, the railings actually saved her life, because she didn't suffer any brain injuries. Paloma's still in hospital. Once she leaves, she'll have to go through rehabilitation to learn how to walk again. It'll take years for her to recover completely. He says that he really appreciates the health system after the accident, that if they'd been in the US Paloma's care would've cost them a fortune, and that if you fall from a window in the States you get left on your own. He then writes about a relative of his who was treated in hospital LA, and that for 14 days in hospital it cost her 19,000 dollars. In Europe governments are making cuts to the health system, its one of the two systems most at risk, along with the education system. His sister's accident's made him appreciate the UK more, and that he doesn't understand how people in the US can trust private companies with looking after their health. Obama's health reforms are a step in the right direction, but it'll take a lot to change the system. Many Americans see a public health system as a threat to their private health system. Italy's health system is the second best in the world (really??) after the UK, so it has a lot to defend; and we should defend it a lot more in the future. Thank you very much for the translation. Much apreciated. Thanks also Robi for posting the original. As people have said, with both Paloma and Axie, it really brings home how fragile life is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Thank you very much for the translation. Much apreciated. Thanks also Robi for posting the original. As people have said, with both Paloma and Axie, it really brings home how fragile life is. Absolutely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laymay kang Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 this column make myself more thinking..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IngievV Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 It is ridiculous that we have to pay for health care any way. Isn't it a human right we all have? I know it's even worse in America, but for example I had to pay 100 euros a month at first for healthcare, then it was raised to 120 and it will be raised again. You have to start coughing up the money every month yourself, the day you turn 18. When I had to get some simple medication, I still had to pay extra money, even though I pay that much every month. It sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miek Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 It is ridiculous that we have to pay for health care any way. Isn't it a human right we all have? I know it's even worse in America, but for example I had to pay 100 euros a month at first for healthcare, then it was raised to 120 and it will be raised again. You have to start coughing up the money every month yourself, the day you turn 18. When I had to get some simple medication, I still had to pay extra money, even though I pay that much every month. It sucks. I think the healthcare system in Holland is pretty good compared to other countries. I do understand your point, it's a lot of money each month, and if you need almost no care it seems rediculous. I'm in and out of hospital for the last 9 years and had several operations, medications, physical therapy, orthopedic stuff. So in my case, the monthly payments are a lot, but not enough to cover my costs. And I never had a bill. So there's 2 sides of our healthcare system I guess. You just have to get really sick or hurt, and get your moneys worth But it is a lot of money every month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IngievV Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I think the healthcare system in Holland is pretty good compared to other countries. I do understand your point, it's a lot of money each month, and if you need almost no care it seems rediculous. I'm in and out of hospital for the last 9 years and had several operations, medications, physical therapy, orthopedic stuff. So in my case, the monthly payments are a lot, but not enough to cover my costs. And I never had a bill. So there's 2 sides of our healthcare system I guess. You just have to get really sick or hurt, and get your moneys worth But it is a lot of money every month. True, but the system could be better. For me, it's hard to get all that money together as a student. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miek Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 True, but the system could be better. For me, it's hard to get all that money together as a student. I know, it's a lot. Especially if you don't need much care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fmbm Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Health care in the US is ridiculous. My mom might have to cancel our health insurance if they raise it to $1000 a month. If that happens, we have to hope and pray that nothing terribly serious happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IngievV Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I know, it's a lot. Especially if you don't need much care. I could save all that money each month for Mika trips:mf_rosetinted: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willywonka Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 and Wonka...I can only imagine how hard it could be for both you and your family...and I don't even want to think what could have happened to my mother if the life insurace haven't payed the bills (even though it dosen't cover the payment's %100) because both the cemo and the medicine is overly expensive for a disease like this which can actually cost your life..It drives me mad how people can put a price on a humans life... I am incredibly happy that you're still with us and I wish you'll never have to face with a situation like that again..and I truly mean it with all my heart... Awwwww, thanks, Rosie.... I could save all that money each month for Mika trips:mf_rosetinted: Specially for a Portugal trip this summer, innit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siu Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 It is ridiculous that we have to pay for health care any way. Isn't it a human right we all have? I know it's even worse in America, but for example I had to pay 100 euros a month at first for healthcare, then it was raised to 120 and it will be raised again. You have to start coughing up the money every month yourself, the day you turn 18. When I had to get some simple medication, I still had to pay extra money, even though I pay that much every month. It sucks. In addition to the money you pay monthly for health care, is there a tax which finances the health care system? EDIT: not you as a student, but the working population? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suzie Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 It is ridiculous that we have to pay for health care any way. Isn't it a human right we all have? There is something important that should not be neglected though: nothing in life is for free. Hospitals need money to run, doctors and nurses need to be trained and paid – they don’t just fall down from the sky and take care of you like little angels… Healthcare is not ’free’ in the UK, either, as it is paid for by general taxation. Siu mentioned that in Estonia, social tax is 33% (perhaps social security and pension scheme together). In Hungary, we have a similar rate: employers pay 24% to the state on top of the gross salary of the employee as a compulsory social security tax and employees pay an additional 10% from their gross salary that goes to their pension scheme. The question really is if it is the individual who should be made responsible for guaranteeing their future well-being or it should be down to the state to ensure there is enough money collected from citizens to sponsor it – whether it is fully or only partly state-financed. In my personal opinion, you cannot solely rely on individuals to take care of themselves by voluntarily paying their contribution – it needs to be regulated by law. Once it’s done, however, a basic health service should be available for every citizen free of charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naectegale Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 There is something important that should not be neglected though: nothing in life is for free. Hospitals need money to run, doctors and nurses need to be trained and paid – they don’t just fall down from the sky and take care of you like little angels… Healthcare is not ’free’ in the UK, either, as it is paid for by general taxation. Siu mentioned that in Estonia, social tax is 33% (perhaps social security and pension scheme together). In Hungary, we have a similar rate: employers pay 24% to the state on top of the gross salary of the employee as a compulsory social security tax and employees pay an additional 10% from their gross salary that goes to their pension scheme. The question really is if it is the individual who should be made responsible for guaranteeing their future well-being or it should be down to the state to ensure there is enough money collected from citizens to sponsor it – whether it is fully or only partly state-financed. In my personal opinion, you cannot solely rely on individuals to take care of themselves by voluntarily paying their contribution – it needs to be regulated by law. Once it’s done, however, a basic health service should be available for every citizen free of charge. Suzie - you talk a lot of sense All health care costs money, and it's not cheap to run hospitals and train & pay doctors and nurses - and I don't think they are particularly well paid in the UK. The important point is that the treatment is free at the point of use, and not rationed according to how much you can afford. What does upset me is when people take the system for granted. I'm sure a lot of people wouldn't get drunk and fight or have acccidents if they had to pay for treatment every time. Some A&E services are overrun with drunks at night and it's not nice for the staff or other patients to have to deal with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naectegale Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 As a citizen of a country where people do have to pay for treatment every time (and quite a painful amount just for basic first aid, let alone anything like a cast for a broken bone,) I can tell you that people still get drunk, fight, and have accidents frequently. Emergency rooms full of drunken idiots are not exclusive to countries where people don't have to pay out of their own pockets for care. Thanks - that's good to know (in a strange way) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siu Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 There is something important that should not be neglected though: nothing in life is for free. Hospitals need money to run, doctors and nurses need to be trained and paid – they don’t just fall down from the sky and take care of you like little angels… Healthcare is not ’free’ in the UK, either, as it is paid for by general taxation. Siu mentioned that in Estonia, social tax is 33% (perhaps social security and pension scheme together). In Hungary, we have a similar rate: employers pay 24% to the state on top of the gross salary of the employee as a compulsory social security tax and employees pay an additional 10% from their gross salary that goes to their pension scheme. The question really is if it is the individual who should be made responsible for guaranteeing their future well-being or it should be down to the state to ensure there is enough money collected from citizens to sponsor it – whether it is fully or only partly state-financed. In my personal opinion, you cannot solely rely on individuals to take care of themselves by voluntarily paying their contribution – it needs to be regulated by law. Once it’s done, however, a basic health service should be available for every citizen free of charge. When I said that medical services in the UK are free I didn't mean that they are completely free and there's money falling down from the sky to finance it . What I meant was that in order to get the services you need, you don't have to give out cash every time you enter a clinic and pray that your insurance covers it. There are pros and cons to solidarity in the health care system (and in taxation in general), but in fact it's an important pillar of a well working society. I do not understand how the poorer population in the US is able to afford medical services if for a fortnight in the hospital you have to pay $19,000! In general the better off population has better health compared to poor people, whereas the latter has less money to spend on their health. You are right – the 33% social tax finances bot the health care and pension funds. And I totally agree with the last point you made Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IngievV Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 (edited) Specially for a Portugal trip this summer, innit? Right-o:naughty: There is something important that should not be neglected though: nothing in life is for free. Hospitals need money to run, doctors and nurses need to be trained and paid – they don’t just fall down from the sky and take care of you like little angels… Healthcare is not ’free’ in the UK, either, as it is paid for by general taxation. Siu mentioned that in Estonia, social tax is 33% (perhaps social security and pension scheme together). In Hungary, we have a similar rate: employers pay 24% to the state on top of the gross salary of the employee as a compulsory social security tax and employees pay an additional 10% from their gross salary that goes to their pension scheme. The question really is if it is the individual who should be made responsible for guaranteeing their future well-being or it should be down to the state to ensure there is enough money collected from citizens to sponsor it – whether it is fully or only partly state-financed. In my personal opinion, you cannot solely rely on individuals to take care of themselves by voluntarily paying their contribution – it needs to be regulated by law. Once it’s done, however, a basic health service should be available for every citizen free of charge. Of course I am aware it can't be for free, but healthcare here isn't generally organised, also a lot of different companies and some for example won't cover the costs in a certain hospital because of whatever reason. The healthcare here is not bad, but it could be better. And the thing that bothers me most is that we have to pay more and more, the government cuts on healthcare and education, and so we will all have to pay up for their faults. But that is another discussion:roftl: Edited March 4, 2011 by IngievV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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