New song: Underwater

[IngievV]

this is actually quite impressive:biggrin2:

you should have done EMD design too:roftl:

 

Whyyy the Elle Me Dit cover was very beautiful and stuff:mf_rosetinted:

 

I keep repeating the lines in my head. Under water, under water under water UNDERWATEEERRRR.

 

Yup, he's done a good job:naughty:

 

Lesson 1 in song writing, keep repeating the title of the song so it will stick in people's heads.

[buttonslovesu]

i hear (something)shot and leaving me raw

Or maybe Your short of leavin me raw??

Edited September 22, 2011 by buttonslovesu

[holysusie]

Lesson 1 in song writing, keep repeating the title of the song so it will stick in people's heads.

 

You better not say it out loud, or we'll get the album full of one-line songs:aah:

[basicamenteyo]

I'm not being sarcastic. I CAN be sarcastic, but I'm not usually here on the

MFC.

 

Why are you so upset that you don't like it? I don't like Blame it on the Weather AT ALL, but what can you do? I still manage to get along with people who DO like it.

 

 

Oh, and I still get along with everybody aswell!! I´m upset but not because you all love it, but because I CAN´T. And I´d love to see the rythm here, or to feel moved by the lyrics...

 

And yes, I know Relax or Rain are repeating till the end the same words, but I wanted to compare it to GK or TB. In TB there´s no one word being repeated, and in GK... well, that songs has so much "Mika" in it... I´m sure it´s cause he explained like 3.000 times how upset he was when he wrote it, and stuff, and I´m sure that if Mika comes to explain us how it was when a guy put his lips on him (or a girl, who knows?) and tells us the complete story of this song, maybe I´ll love it too!

 

I must admit I woke up today singing the underwater part....

 

This was a very interesting post (thanks Christine!) because I can't see much difference in the lines you mentioned myself, I really can't (I mean as English lines). Finnish language is very different than English, because most things sound fake or ridiculous in Finnish. Finnish people don't even use the word "love", not often. I never say "I love you" to even my kids or husband. I say "you are very dear to me". Most times we say absolutely nothing, and we assume the silence tells it all In Finnish words need to be very very simple and not exaggerating, otherwise they are fake or make us feel only silly.

 

I can understand my husband though, because I love Karen even I can't understand the lyrics. I love Mika's voice in it, and his voice is the most important thing why I listen to him. I really don't have similar strong feelings for all his songs. Toy Boy is definitely not in my top10 songs I don't think it's a problem. Whether you like a song or not is personal. I know that many people see Toy Boy as one of his best songs. Lol, in the end every song is brilliant when he is on stage singing it in front of me, it's the way he performs and his voice live that matters. For me live versions are always more important than album versions, but it's important for him as an artist to make good albums, of course I want the third album to be good, have a strong theme and no weak songs.

 

Here it´s the same... there are things that we usually say here, words or expressions that I´d never use in Spanish cause they sound rubbish If I translate "put your lips on me and I can live underwater" into Spanish... It would be like to laugh my arse off for ages... (but it´s the same with "when it rains and rains and rains and rains....." or "i could be brown, I could be blue..." (HOW THE F*CK COULD YOU BE BROWN OR BLUE,FFS?!?!?!) but he looks so good singing it...

 

 

About live versions I´m totally with you. I don´t like Blue Eyes, but I love him singing it live. Same with Happy Ending... These two songs are not in my ipod, so I need to read the lyrics before a gig so I can remember them These songs seem to me a bit boring in the recorded version but I love every single thing he does live. Unless Kick Ass, which I love more the recorded version. (uh,yeah... Am I ever happy?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

anyway....

 

 

underwater

underwater

underwateeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeer...

[basicamenteyo]

A question for native speakers... how do you know he says "I can LIVE underwater" instead of "I can LEAVE underwater"?? Only because of the meaning, or is there any "pronouncing" difference?

[Marilyn Mastin]

One thing I love about UW, also the others EMD, Karen, and even BIOTW, is that Mika is using his lower voice more. His lower voice is gorgeous!!

But with UW, I think he's written a perfect Mika song. The verses are low, and then the chorus kicks in with the high vocalisation. But the high vocalisation in the chorus is not annoying (like the chorus of Rain can be imho) in fact the chorus of UW kind-of reminds me of the high-vocalisation he performs at the start of Relax, which has always made me melt into goo!

So Mika will be pulling people to him with the beautiful verse of the song, then he'll hit them with the high chorus and they'll be hooked, and (hopefully) will think. "I didn't realise that Mika was SOOO GOOOOD!":mf_lustslow:

I'm also thrilled that we are seeing this romantic side of Mika. After all, he is 28 now, he's looking really handsome, and I think the new songs will gain him a whole new army of fans.

There may still be songs with stories to them, but I'm loving this new side of Mika a whole lot, and I'm really hopeful for the album.

[suzie]

Actually, I cannot explain to myself why Under Water appleals me more than the rest of new songs. The melody is simple, the lyrics are simple.

He puts the same passion in singing BIOTW as in Underwater...so what?

Kesha, Pink and Katy Perry also have simple melodies and lyrics yet the end result is pretty different...

 

 

On the personal taste issue that has been discussed here intensively....

I think musical taste is closely related to people’s personality and is also shaped by culture or one’s own life experience as Christine mentioned earlier. It also changes with age, so a song like the monotonous EMD that slightly resembles some children’s chant in the verses is more appealing to a younger generation, probably. Of course it is another generalisation and anyone can ’prove’ the opposite as well, like some middle-aged women loving it ( ) , but it still does not necessarily make the observation invalid. I like EMD, too, actually, especially since I can connect the music with the meaning of the song and I can conclude that it ’fits’.

So, as soon as the lyrics come into the picture another dimension is added to people’s understanding of a song and while some may think that the line ”you can be the thunder and I can be the rain” is poetic it makes others climb the walls .

We experience life and love in different ways, not to mention the way we express ourselves. Some of us are more emotive while others prefer to show less emotion to the outside world. So there is nothing wrong with people liking certain songs and others not but when most people express their concern about certain songs or elements of songs, in either the lyrics, the arrangements or the performance itself, it is a valid feedback to the artist since it does not resonate with a large part of the audience. Of course no audience is homogenous but there is some kind of common denominator that pulls them together and this shared trait can be essential in keeping his audience. Successful artists change and innovate all the time but never turn their back to their followers - and neither does Mika, it seems.

As far as the musical element is concerned, I think music is similar to language in a way that it is not a string of random notes put together but has its own rules and some people become more eloquent speakers than others. There is no way you can explain to someone why a certain way of expression works better than another one unless they have a similar level of fluency in that field or at least the openness to understand it.

So, as far as I am concerned, MFC is a platform of expression for me and I discuss things with people who are ready to listen. I don’t want to persuade anyone about my ‘truth’, I am here to read about that of others to shape my understanding.

[Gatagordinha]

A question for native speakers... how do you know he says "I can LIVE underwater" instead of "I can LEAVE underwater"?? Only because of the meaning, or is there any "pronouncing" difference?

 

The vowel in "live" is a short one (like the i in "with") and in "leave" it's longer (like the ee in "sheep")

 

Sometimes, in songs, singers slightly elongate the vowel in "live" so I understand the confusion. However, when they do that, it tends to be a sound more like "eee-uh" rather than the definite long "eeeee" in "leave".

 

Does that help?

Edited September 22, 2011 by Gatagordinha
punctuation fail

[basicamenteyo]

The vowel in "live" is a short one (like the i in "with") and in "leave" it's longer (like the ee in "sheep")

 

Sometimes, in songs, singers slightly elongate the vowel in "live" so I understand the confusion. However, when they do that, it tends to be a sound more like "eee-uh" rather than the definite long "eeeee" in "leave".

 

Does that help?

 

:aah:

 

not at all :aah:

 

but thank you very much. yes I know that in English words like sheep has a long pronunciation, but seriously, singing, I can´t find the difference...

 

So, if you "cut" the song and only listen to the moment when he says "live"... could you perfectly know he says "live" instead of "leave" if you never listened the song before? I know I sound like a pain in the ass, but in Spanish it never happens, we don´t have words which are phonetically identic to others... (now I´m not sure if I´m making sense) and I´m also amazed that not even English speakers can understand the lyrics of the song... this doesn´t happen in Spanish (again it´s because of our phonetics are maybe more contundents....) and I can´t imagine a lot of Spaniards discussing about some lyrics in Spanish...

 

 

thank you very much for your explanation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, btw... I´m starting to liking the song.

[tiibet]

Kesha, Pink and Katy Perry also have simple melodies and lyrics yet the end result is pretty different...

 

I didn't mean simple in that way in my own post, I meant simple as in a beautiful and honest way... Like if you say something in lyrics in a simple way it sounds more true. Lol, does it make any sense?

 

(I quoted only that part, but it was a good post, I agree with everything. It's so true that kids love EMD, and I think adults like it when they want to feel light and happy, to be in a good mood.)

Edited September 22, 2011 by tiibet

[Mikabéa]

I didn't see the link for the MP3 ... so I put it :

 

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HLWH36DW

 

 

And sorry if someone made it

[IngievV]

You better not say it out loud, or we'll get the album full of one-line songs:aah:

 

The vowel in "live" is a short one (like the i in "with") and in "leave" it's longer (like the ee in "sheep")

 

Sometimes, in songs, singers slightly elongate the vowel in "live" so I understand the confusion. However, when they do that, it tends to be a sound more like "eee-uh" rather than the definite long "eeeee" in "leave".

 

Does that help?

 

Yeah, it won't make much sense to many but the phonetic description is:

 

| liːv | = leave. i: is a long i. Like ie

 

| lIv| = Live. With a short i.

Edited September 22, 2011 by IngievV

[guylainem123]

Yeah, it won't make much sense to many but the phonetic description is:

 

| liːv | = leave. i: is a long i. Like ie

 

| lIv| = Live. With a short i.

 

I used to love phonetics at school lol

[IngievV]

I used to love phonetics at school lol

 

It's giving me nightmares. Especially when the resit of it determined whether or not I finished my first year completely. I did though:naughty:

[willywonka]

TOOL's 12 songs:

 

EMD

 

Elle ne me dit pas (ENMDP)

 

BIOTW

 

Blame it on the meteo site (BIOTMS)

 

Blame it on the vulcan's ashes (BIOTVA)

 

Karen

 

Who the heck is Karen

 

UW

 

Above water (AW)

 

I'm into scuba diving and i like it

 

Why oh why did i have to wear my speedos (now that paparazzi won't leave?)

 

I used to be afraid of sharks (but not anymore)

Edited September 22, 2011 by willywonka

[Christine]

I hope he doesn't scrap BIOTW - because of what is being written here.

 

I hope he doesn't scrap it because of what is being written here either but because he has many more better songs to put on the album. The piano melody is lovely but it sounds like it's 60 years old and the lyrics are beyond cheesy, they are just cringeworthy.

 

BIOTW = probably a song that so many could relate to.

 

I don't know, maybe in Europe I can't imagine anyone in North America under the age of 50 or 60 relating to this song the way it is. It would have already been considered old fashioned and lame when I was a teenager in the early 80s.

 

I think you sound too harsh and offensive.

 

Aw remember when you used to say that to me? Now you are agreeing with me.

 

I thought UW was very powerful since the very first time I heard it, more powerful than his songs for a long time, it had my heart completely

 

Yes that was my reaction too. I adore it, nothing more to say.

 

And yes, I know Relax or Rain are repeating till the end the same words, but I wanted to compare it to GK or TB.

 

Yes but just so you know, we are not comparing it to GK or TB. I don't see the word masterpiece being thrown around. It doesn't have to be a lyrical masterpiece to enjoy it immensely. I am a huge fan of trance music with very few and simple lyrics. If a song has bad, cringeworthy lyrics it's offputting, but that's a different situation.

 

If I translate "put your lips on me and I can live underwater" into Spanish... It would be like to laugh my arse off for ages... (but it´s the same with "when it rains and rains and rains and rains....." or "i could be brown, I could be blue..." (HOW THE F*CK COULD YOU BE BROWN OR BLUE,FFS?!?!?!)

 

Well this is just as absurd in English. Yes you could be brown in skin colour or blue in mood but that's not his point when he carries on by saying he could be violet sky. Have you seen the animation about purple pop stars? It's about the absurdity of the music industry trying to mold artists to the flavour of the month in order to make money instead of develop talent. It doesn't mean that purple pop stars are something familiar and normal to English speakers. I assure you none of us had ever heard of purple pop stars before Mika (well, maybe Prince)

 

One thing I love about UW, also the others EMD, Karen, and even BIOTW, is that Mika is using his lower voice more. His lower voice is gorgeous!!

 

Yes me too. It's not just that it's a pleasant tone, but he seems to be able to convey emotion with less effort/strain.

 

So, if you "cut" the song and only listen to the moment when he says "live"... could you perfectly know he says "live" instead of "leave" if you never listened the song before?

 

Yes. Mika has some really odd phrasing in his songs (we talked about this a lot when we were deciphering the lyrics for Good Gone Girl), but even in this case "live" sounds distinctive to "leave" to me and I don't need the context of the other lyrics to hear the difference.

 

I know I sound like a pain in the ass, but in Spanish it never happens, we don´t have words which are phonetically identic to others...

 

Live and leave are definitely not phonetically identical no matter what your accent is and even in Mika's pronunciation here. Maybe you just need to be speaking/listening to English longer to be able to pick it up.

 

Oh, btw... I´m starting to liking the song.

 

 

I meant to say something about U2 in here somewhere but I can't remember who I was quoting or where I was going with that. Anyway this song has the same sort of build up and Mika is singing with the same passion that I felt from Bono in the earlyish days of U2 (circa 1985). I think that's probably the reason it reached me so quickly on an emotional level.

 

Sorry for the megapost

[crazyaboutmika]

TOOL's 12 songs:

 

EMD

 

Elle ne me dit pas (ENMDP)

 

BIOTW

 

Blame it on the meteo site (BIOTMS)

 

Blame it on the vulcan's ashes (BIOTVA)

 

Karen

 

Who the heck is Karen

 

UW

 

Above water (AW)

 

I'm into scuba diving and i like it

 

Why oh why did i have to wear my speedos (now that paparazzi won't leave?)

 

I used to be afraid of sharks (but not anymore)

 

[crazyaboutmika]

Oh, btw... I´m starting to liking the song.

I knew you would

[petra_ale]

TOOL's 12 songs:

 

EMD

 

Elle ne me dit pas (ENMDP)

 

BIOTW

 

Blame it on the meteo site (BIOTMS)

 

Blame it on the vulcan's ashes (BIOTVA)

 

Karen

 

Who the heck is Karen

 

UW

 

Above water (AW)

 

I'm into scuba diving and i like it

 

Why oh why did i have to wear my speedos (now that paparazzi won't leave?)

 

I used to be afraid of sharks (but not anymore)

 

Genius!

 

 

I only got to listen to UW a few times yesterday and went to bed vexed that I couldn't even remember a single note off it but when I came home today and put the song, it felt completely different - I remembered it all as if it's been played in my head all night while sleeping - and now I love it.

 

The only thing I am not very impressed with is the piano in the beginning, although I think it goes really well with the song. It's just that in its simplicity it reminded me of a bunch of other songs, namely his 'Everybody's Talking' cover and even Karen (even when I listened to Karen I still thought of ET). I don't know why my mind always finds something connected to Everybody's Talking lately

 

But all in all, yes, THIS song definitely hit the right note for me.

[crazyaboutmika]

It's giving me nightmares. Especially when the resit of it determined whether or not I finished my first year completely. I did though:naughty:

I hated those too

And never needed them

[crazyaboutmika]

maybe we can have a thread where each of us states which songs they love and hate and why, as a personal vent, but no one can reply or question it!

I was thinking the same thing

Let's open it (but only if no one can reply or question)

[robertina]

I was thinking the same thing

Let's open it (but only if no one can reply or question)

 

as I said...Guy would kill me if I do!

 

"robi, not everything needs a thread!"

[dcdeb]

First of all...

 

TOOL's 12 songs

 

Wonka, you are (and I say this with great affection) totally insane

 

 

there's nothing harsh in contructive criticism IMO.

Let's agree we can disagree!

 

Actually, I cannot explain to myself why Under Water appleals me more than the rest of new songs. The melody is simple, the lyrics are simple.

He puts the same passion in singing BIOTW as in Underwater...so what?

 

I would like some music maestro would show us where the trick is, how the costruction/production of the song makes it OK or not.

 

and then maybe we will come to the conclusion that it's only a matter of taste. We are not music experts, so anything we may say it's just personal IMO.

 

But if we say it HERE, in Mika's fanclub, we say it with love for sure.

 

That's for sure, Robi -- and I wish I could explain why this song is so much

more appealing to me than BIOTW. Both are love songs, both are ballads...

But the imagery in Under Water is so much stronger, less saccharin-sweet

to me. I mean, if Mika had simply said, "Kiss me" instead of "Put your lips

on me" it would have meant the same thing, but would not have evoked

the same kind of feeling for me... It's those subtle differences in this

song that make it work, for me -- and I stress "for me" because I get

that other people don't feel it/react to it the same way.

 

i hear (something)shot and leaving me raw

Or maybe Your short of leavin me raw??

 

Yes, something along those lines -- shot/short and raw is what I'm hearing

too. It'll come, it'll come...

 

underwater

underwater

underwateeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeer...

 

Are you sure you're not just saying that?

 

A question for native speakers... how do you know he says "I can LIVE underwater" instead of "I can LEAVE underwater"?? Only because of the meaning, or is there any "pronouncing" difference?

 

As others have said, the short "I" in live is distinct from the long E sound in

leave. If you listen carefully you can hear the difference. But if there

is any doubt, like with this performance and the sound is not as clear as

you'd like it to be, yes, you have to look at the context in which the word

is used. When I'm trying to figure out the lyrics, that's what I end up

doing -- I ask myself, "what word does that sound like?" followed by "does it

fit with the rest of the words I'm hearing?"

[basicamenteyo]

 

 

Well this is just as absurd in English. Yes you could be brown in skin colour or blue in mood but that's not his point when he carries on by saying he could be violet sky. Have you seen the animation about purple pop stars? It's about the absurdity of the music industry trying to mold artists to the flavour of the month in order to make money instead of develop talent. It doesn't mean that purple pop stars are something familiar and normal to English speakers. I assure you none of us had ever heard of purple pop stars before Mika (well, maybe Prince)

 

 

 

Oh... I thought maybe it was slang or something... so he´s just crazy, no matter the language... good

 

I knew you would

 

Yeah, maybe I´m a fangurl at heart....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Are you sure you're not just saying that?

 

 

 

As others have said, the short "I" in live is distinct from the long E sound in

leave. If you listen carefully you can hear the difference. But if there

is any doubt, like with this performance and the sound is not as clear as

you'd like it to be, yes, you have to look at the context in which the word

is used. When I'm trying to figure out the lyrics, that's what I end up

doing -- I ask myself, "what word does that sound like?" followed by "does it

fit with the rest of the words I'm hearing?"

 

Yeah, I´m singing it for the whole day... even my son is already tired of it.... "mom is it a Mika song?? it´s awful, stop singing that" kids....

 

 

 

 

 

And after reading your posts.... IS IT THAT YOU ENGLISH SPEAKERS HAVE A SUBJECT AT SCHOOL TO STUDY PHONETICS???? :shocked:

 

Oh God!!! That explains how difficult is for us non-speakers to understand you... In Spain an "a" sounds the same no matter where it is, I mean.. in english the "o" of the word "word" it´s not the same than in "good". That doesn´t happen here. The "o" has the same phonetic ALWAYS. And I´m totally freaking out trying to understand you all!!!! That´s why even if I can (more or less) explain myself here and understand what you type, it becomes a nightmare when I need to speak or to understand anyother´s talk.

[Christine]

And after reading your posts.... IS IT THAT YOU ENGLISH SPEAKERS HAVE A SUBJECT AT SCHOOL TO STUDY PHONETICS???? :shocked:

 

Oh God!!! That explains how difficult is for us non-speakers to understand you... In Spain an "a" sounds the same no matter where it is, I mean.. in english the "o" of the word "word" it´s not the same than in "good". That doesn´t happen here. The "o" has the same phonetic ALWAYS. And I´m totally freaking out trying to understand you all!!!! That´s why even if I can (more or less) explain myself here and understand what you type, it becomes a nightmare when I need to speak or to understand anyother´s talk.

 

English has so much influence from French (and the original Latin) on top of the Germanic core and then you've got so many regional dialects in Britain that were influencing spellings before they became standardized. When I was learning spelling in school I could not understand why many words were not spelled more phonetically and why there were so many inconsistencies between words with the same sounds. But after living in Britain for a few years, studying English history and learning French basics it makes a *bit* more sense.